Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
So if materia is what is used to perform magic then the magic is not really neutral itself, the materia is.STOP TALKING ABOUT SEPHIROTH!
I don't believe it's said how. It just does.
No...it wouldn't matter if either a good guy or a bad guy had materia for the fire spell. The result would still be the spell, fire, neither good nor evil.
Very well.
Based on it protecting against evil magic, though I gave you an instance where an evil person uses TK on Link an you said "Sure", which tells me Kefka's TK would work on Link, despite being evil.
Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
So how, exactly, does materia get used to perform magic? If it isn't the magic itself, then the magic has to come from the person.
Materia is made from Mako. Mako is technically the source of all the magic and it can form materia in nature, though it takes a while. Shinra compressed Mako into materia, which is used by villain and good guy alike. Materia produces the magic, it technically isn't the magic itself.
Which doesn't really matter as at the moment I can't think of any TK preformed by materia at the moment anyway, and the only reason I brought up Sephy was to see exactly how Link's TK resistance works.
Mewtwo, while being a douche, uses TK on Link. Result?
Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Ganondorf. Zant. Just about any boss monster he's fought before can do one of the above, some two and a few, all.Alright, I'll bite. What is stasis supposed to be since it apparently isn't what I thought it was.
Yeah. I mentioned the hearing and sensing, right? And again, he doesn't have to turn. All he really needs is one hit and he'd cut Raziel in half. Of course he can't hold anyone still anyway.
Here's a new idea. Show me Raziel focusing any TK on just one area of the body instead of the whole.
Yeah. Probably. Lol. You've made it a point to argue that Link will be hit from his blind spot.
Iron Boots weigh more like 70 tons.
Yeah. Kind of put a shot in your disorientation hope. But suddenly the point has changed. You afraid of being wrong?
I disagree. For one I've only seen LoK's TK used within the general vicinity. So once Raziel tosses Link, he's probably out of range. And again, pointless endeavor is pointless.
Yeah, and it can even be better when the horse bounces up and down and moves even faster than the flight through the air would be.
Wouldn't mind seeing Raziel toss something into a spin or upside down.
I agree. It's nothing alike at all.
He needs a hell of a lot more than one second. He is not that fast. Poes on horseback. He doesn't have to be blind, since Raziel really isn't that fast anyway. Raziel does not have the time for all these things that you want to happen, lol.
And that's kind of what I was counting on.
Really don't know what this is supposed to prove. Raziel's agility really isn't that great though.
I do. Limited distance. Arrow in his body. Link isn't being affected by anything he hits. Pick one.
Evidence for what?
It's durable enough to survive Link using it. It isn't snapping for Raziel's TK or his arms.
Show me them doing it to him. I dont recall this happening and link doing fine at all, because it simply did not happen.
Its the same as kinetic shackles, holds someone up while Raziel can do what he wants. Same as Kinetic shackles.
Hes going to have to turn if Raziel comes from a direction behind or above him, and problem is Raziel has ways of avoiding this, Link does not.
"yeah" and "probably" dont make an argument.....how? show me him doing anything alike to defeating this combination....
😆 no they dont.
Youve not proven anything so far, you cant simply claim "he wont be disoritentated" and account it for evidence. Hes being tossed around, anyone would have hardly any idea whats going on in the same situation, including Link.
TK does not cover space so I dont know how distance can come into it. And how would he be out of range? I lold....
Physics and gravity cause the spinning or twisting , its kinda what happens if your tossed like a doll. You dont stand vertical while in flight if your tossed to the left or right.
Ofc its nothing alike, horse archery is a specific style that can be trained and Link is not in any disadvantage but being physically tossed he would be.
yes he is, one second it takes to either go invisible or to blind Link. once that happens he may need 1 more second for the kill or to use TK and make Link useless/helpless. 1 second for the beginning of a victory, 2 seconds for a final victory.
I would like to see Link jump 4-5 meters from platform to platform in a second.
limited distance does not excist, arrows? 😆 your spamming a point, youve not proven Link can fire an arrow while being thrown and while blind. Yeh because Link has durability...oh wait no he does not...its been calculated that even Links best feat is poor and not enough.
Evidence for all your claims would be nice, start with proving what I asked for in the first reply and then go on to proving that Link can shoot arrows while blind.
Thats not impressive at all because Links not strong and if he was, he would have a canon example of putting effort into the bow and it not breaking...the bow is being snapped like a twig until that example is shown.
Originally posted by MooCowofJusticeI don't believe it's said how. It just does.
Its not said, and its not shown and most Tk is not magic based, but mental. The MS protects against no TK. Its an assumption from fans just because as Bloodrain pointed out, they think just because Zant or Ganon did not use it, means its an immunity.
Yeah, MewTwo's TK would work. Of course that's irrelevant anyway, he'd probably just mindwipe Link.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Show me them doing it to him. I dont recall this happening and link doing fine at all, because it simply did not happen.
He defeats every boss. Every boss he's fought can toss him around. Bongo Bongo is the same as blinding him. The fish boss in Majora's Mask is the same as being blind to it. Excuse me for not wanting to waste my time digging through videos so you can ignore them.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Its the same as kinetic shackles, holds someone up while Raziel can do what he wants. Same as Kinetic shackles.
K. So he breaks it.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Hes going to have to turn if Raziel comes from a direction behind or above him, and problem is Raziel has ways of avoiding this, Link does not.
Twist the body and swing your arm. Viola.
Originally posted by Burning thought
"yeah" and "probably" dont make an argument.....how? show me him doing anything alike to defeating this combination....
I would tell you about it. But I can't remember what you're insisting I show you and I'm not going to go look back through the thread for it.
Originally posted by Burning thought
😆 no they dont.
Compelling argument. Didn't you just criticize me for that?
Originally posted by Burning thought
Youve not proven anything so far, you cant simply claim "he wont be disoritentated" and account it for evidence. Hes being tossed around, anyone would have hardly any idea whats going on in the same situation, including Link.
Ten feet distance, BT. A normal man would not be disoriented.
Originally posted by Burning thought
TK does not cover space so I dont know how distance can come into it. And how would he be out of range? I lold....
Beats me. But there's no indication he can do it.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Physics and gravity cause the spinning or twisting , its kinda what happens if your tossed like a doll. You dont stand vertical while in flight if your tossed to the left or right.
Hilarious. But spinning through the air would require force only applied to one part of the body, while ignoring the other. Say, one arm is grabbed and thrown. But I've yet to see evidence Raziel can focus on such a small portion of a body.
Spinning is also stupid because Link makes a habit out of doing it incredibly fast for an attack.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Ofc its nothing alike, horse archery is a specific style that can be trained and Link is not in any disadvantage but being physically tossed he would be.
Actually, horse archery would be more challenging. What with moving at a faster speed and bouncing with the horse's steps.
Originally posted by Burning thought
yes he is, one second it takes to either go invisible or to blind Link. once that happens he may need 1 more second for the kill or to use TK and make Link useless/helpless. 1 second for the beginning of a victory, 2 seconds for a final victory.
Both of which accomplish either forcing Link to use the Lens of Truth which takes less time than it would for Raziel to become invisible. Blinding just means Link has to rely on hearing and sensing Raziel.
At the point of the next second, Link is ready for something. TK will be broken, a kill attempt can be reacted to, with normal human reaction time I might add.
Riiiiiiiight.
Originally posted by Burning thought
I would like to see Link jump 4-5 meters from platform to platform in a second.
For what purpose? He's too busy to indulge your strange fantasies.
Originally posted by Burning thought
limited distance does not excist, arrows? 😆 your spamming a point, youve not proven Link can fire an arrow while being thrown and while blind. Yeh because Link has durability...oh wait no he does not...its been calculated that even Links best feat is poor and not enough.
Proooooove iiiiiit! 😄
I'm quite sure blindness doesn't last forever. And I don't need to prove he can shoot an arrow while blind. He can easily do it while thrown. Horse archery. Shit is legit.
Yeah, he does have durability. You crazy? He took a force of 1,000 tons. That's the equal and opposite reaction argument you reminded me of. Thanks.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Evidence for all your claims would be nice, start with proving what I asked for in the first reply and then go on to proving that Link can shoot arrows while blind.
You've seen evidence for shit I've claimed before. All this crap I'm not going to waste time digging up because you'll just ignore it. Kind of like you've been ignoring everything since I first started acknowledging you.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Thats not impressive at all because Links not strong and if he was, he would have a canon example of putting effort into the bow and it not breaking...the bow is being snapped like a twig until that example is shown.
The bow is used after he possess the Golden Gauntlets. Mostly because you get this nifty tool called the Light Arrows. I believe from Zelda.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Its not said, and its not shown and most Tk is not magic based, but mental. The MS protects against no TK. Its an assumption from fans just because as Bloodrain pointed out, they think just because Zant or Ganon did not use it, means its an immunity.
So Zant AND Ganon simply chose not to use it on Link despite the fact that they could?
And I'm still pretty damn sure we found a quote. But I don't remember where.
Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
So Zant AND Ganon simply chose not to use it on Link despite the fact that they could?And I'm still pretty damn sure we found a quote. But I don't remember where.
That's not unlikely.... Going back to FF7 again, Sephy uses TK on the entire party before the boss battle, where he never uses it again. CIS or PIS, whatever you'd like to call it.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Correct. It's possible it might not require the evil descriptor, given the sword's sentience, but there's a large debate on that.
So, even if TK is neutral(as both good guys and bad guys can use it), it won't work if used by someone evil?
Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Yeah, MewTwo's TK would work. Of course that's irrelevant anyway, he'd probably just mindwipe Link.He defeats every boss. Every boss he's fought can toss him around. Bongo Bongo is the same as blinding him. The fish boss in Majora's Mask is the same as being blind to it. Excuse me for not wanting to waste my time digging through videos so you can ignore them.
K. So he breaks it.
Twist the body and swing your arm. Viola.
I would tell you about it. But I can't remember what you're insisting I show you and I'm not going to go look back through the thread for it.
Compelling argument. Didn't you just criticize me for that?
Ten feet distance, BT. A normal man would not be disoriented.
Beats me. But there's no indication he can do it.
Hilarious. But spinning through the air would require force only applied to one part of the body, while ignoring the other. Say, one arm is grabbed and thrown. But I've yet to see evidence Raziel can focus on such a small portion of a body.
Spinning is also stupid because Link makes a habit out of doing it incredibly fast for an attack.
Actually, horse archery would be more challenging. What with moving at a faster speed and bouncing with the horse's steps.
Both of which accomplish either forcing Link to use the Lens of Truth which takes less time than it would for Raziel to become invisible. Blinding just means Link has to rely on hearing and sensing Raziel.
At the point of the next second, Link is ready for something. TK will be broken, a kill attempt can be reacted to, with normal human reaction time I might add.
Riiiiiiiight.
For what purpose? He's too busy to indulge your strange fantasies.
Proooooove iiiiiit! 😄
I'm quite sure blindness doesn't last forever. And I don't need to prove he can shoot an arrow while blind. He can easily do it while thrown. Horse archery. Shit is legit.
Yeah, he does have durability. You crazy? He took a force of 1,000 tons. That's the equal and opposite reaction argument you reminded me of. Thanks.
You've seen evidence for shit I've claimed before. All this crap I'm not going to waste time digging up because you'll just ignore it. Kind of like you've been ignoring everything since I first started acknowledging you.
The bow is used after he possess the Golden Gauntlets. Mostly because you get this nifty tool called the Light Arrows. I believe from Zelda.
So Zant AND Ganon simply chose not to use it on Link despite the fact that they could?
And I'm still pretty damn sure we found a quote. But I don't remember where.
He defeats every boss but not every boss or even few of them toss him around with TK only to proceed to blind and then impale him. Its never happened or come close to happeing, their not comparable. I waste my time for the LoZ side, so I think its pretty much necessery if you want to debate this to provide evidence.
And Raziel puts it on him again, etc etc, this could go on until Raziel is in range to slice. Also why on his arms? their the only strong part, shackle something else.
Only thing is, Raziel will be doing that to him using TK, only not in the directions he wants to go. Furthermore being blind or your opponent being invisible sort of ruins that idea.
I did but the thing is we have gone through the iron boots enough times to know theres nothing close to suggesting their 70 tons. I think the closest calculation was under a ton, like 800 pounds.
Oh I think they would if they were being thrown around back and forth, spinning through the air like a doll. Your senses are hardly going to pick up the environment in the same way.
I dont understand what you just said, beats me?...... 😕 thats not an argument.
Its not a small portion, and if he can make shackles around small parts of your body, e.g. writs, shoulders etc then I am pretty certain he can. Also no you would not, if someone just picked you up with Tk and tossed you across the room, only to stop you and toss you the other side before you could get moving, the changes of you being standing static is zero, Links not that steady 😐
yeh, under his own control and standing in one place but when being thrown by someone else and flying through the air? nah....
Show me how horse archery what a real human can do being harder than fireing an arrow accuratly by being launched through the air by someone elses will....thats a lot for you to claim, and quite bold as I said, prove it.
No it doesnt, how does it take less time? hes going to have to find the lense, put it to his eye using up a hand (hes prob going to put away his sword or shield). Big disadvantage. Again, Links not fought someone as agile as Raziel who will be actually killing him and tossing him with TK...whiel hes blind, your making a lot of claims that Link can apprently put up with all these things Raziel can do without being fazed but no proof to back it up.
Tk will be broken? wut? only if Raziel tries to shackle his hands.
I see, so he has not done anything like it? 😕 so what was your case again?
I think its been proven, mind powers dont cover distance/space.
Your making up BS, prove he can fire arrows accuratly while being thrown, blind, having his bow pulled from his hands and smashed into chips of wood etc.
Where you get 1000 tons from? theres no 1000 tons and his best feat as we said is poor. Bloodrain calced that he would be harmed by a punch at 600 tons.
😆 how can I ignore evidence when you have yet to post any for this "shit", as I said I post evidence yet I know you will ignore it. You cant prove Link did or can do any of these things, its not in his game and its not logical either. If Scenario can find Link blindly fireing arrows accuratly while being tossed through the air, I will be very surprised.
Sure, it called CIS. Its important for the plot, because you know if Zant or Ganon curb stomped Link like Raziel does in this thread, the game would be over 🙁
Oh, and TK is a standard term basically used to describe almost any movement of something without physical contact. Unless it's specified that the character has other powers with similar effects, like Magneto's magnetic field manipulation. In Ganon's case, his powers are the result of magic, no specification of mind based powers.