Originally posted by srankmissingninYeah, except we've definitely seen his spine. We've definitely seen it prevent him from being torn apart. We've seen it exposed. We know it's there through countless more instances of on-panel proof than we have instances it maybe isn't.
Christ, it's not a strawman you twit, it is [b]literary your exact argument, merely transposed on a different bone. Wolverine has been impaled through the stomach with blunt instruments measuring more than two feet in diameters half a dozen or more times. Ergo - according to your twisted reasoning - he has no spine. You can back track now and pretend that missing the his sphenoid bone is some how different than missing vertebrae, but you aren't fooling anyone who hasn't spent the majority of their life drinking paint thinner. [/B]
Had Wolverine had only one or two instances where a gaping hole is shown through his abdomen and everybody looking around wondering, "Shouldn't he have a spine there?" but it never being shown, and then several more instances pass by which pretty much confirm, if not cement the fact that he doesn't have a spine (whether or not a sphenoid bone is something that the normal person would know about, much less care about -- it took Wolverithmeticians to teach us this).... then you'd have an appropriate analogy.
That's not the case. So you don't.
Again, nice sh1tty straw-man. Welcome back.
You can't possibly be this stupid. You just CAN'T be... you can't... it's impossible! No one can be this retarded.... unless.... Are you one of the cast members on the Jersy Shore?
That's the only way this nonsense MAKES sense.
Look, you think that your arguments are free from scrutiny for some reason simply based on them being YOUR arguments? Because that's what it looks like.
The bottem line is that "it happened" is not a reasonable answer for something that doesn't make sense.
Wolverine has had multiple instances where he's been under the microscope in NONE of them has some difference in his skull structure been noted.
When he was captured by Weapon-X they were shocked to see the claws in his forearms... But no one mentioned that he was missing full chunks of bone in his skull.
In fact, no one's EVER mentioned that and it's a BIG difference when you're trying to equivocate the connectivity of Wolverine's bone struture or his forearm housed claws to the notion that he's missing those bones because unlike your theory, those things have been outright stated or mentioned at some point in time.
A hunter making assumptions about Sabretooth IS NOT proof of anything pretaining to Wolverine and it's definitely less credible than Weapon ****ing X giving agent zero anti metal bullets to shoot him with.
Wolverine wondering about the effects of an explosive bullet at point blanks range is nothing more than circumstantial evidence... oh but wait, you don't like circumstantial evidence do you?.... so then... why do you use it?
Because we never see a bullet go into Wolverine's brain when he's shot by Scalphunter, we see him get shot in the eye and again someone else assume that he's been shot in the brain.. but do we see the bullet in his brain? I certainly didn't.
We never see a bullet go into Wolverine's brain in his fight with Deadpool, again, it could be just him reaching the end of his rope with his HF.
How about Wolverine's claws going into his brain, at what point can we be sure they reached his brain? The observation of other characters once more? Can we be sure that Wolverine wasn't just in a berserker afterwards? 100% sure? Can we be sure that the claws were not stuck just like the knife that got stuck at the end of Manifest Desti- HEY there's directly contradictory evidence right there. Wow, funny how that works.
Again, you want to talk about circumstantial evidence and how it has no credence but you use it enough.. only deeming what's circumstantial by your own convoluted standards.
Your argument dictates that Logan doesn't have a spine. That's the rationale that your absolutism forces.
You can sit there and act smugg about your so called evidence, pretending that it's not up for debate but as I told you 3 pages ago, it's making you look silly and childish.
I don't know why Jason Aaron would write a whole arc about how hard it was for a doctor to reach Wolverine's brain since it's apparently so easy to reach....
But yeah, no counter argument exists does it?
Any counter argument has no merit does it?
Originally posted by jinzinNobody knew or cared about the sphenoid bone. The only reason we know about it is because you all decided to break out an anatomy book to look for some way to avoid this *gasp* vulnerability that's been used against Wolverine and project real life human anatomy onto a fake comic book feral mutant that clearly has no bone behind his eyes..
Wolverine has had multiple instances where he's been under the microscope in NONE of them has some difference in his skull structure been noted.
... why is it clear? BECAUSE HIS BRAIN'S BEEN PIERCED MULTIPLE TIMES. People have friggin talked about it, even Wolverine!
What don't you get?! Comic book mutant character skeletons don't truly conform to real life humans? Someone sue Marvel!
Get over it. This argument was over which is the more supportable argument. Control your disappointment by keeping the real life science out of this. It's just not how it works in comics. Get over it.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Yeah, except we've definitely seen his spine. We've definitely seen it prevent him from being torn apart. We've seen it exposed. We know it's there through countless more instances of on-panel proof than we have instances it maybe isn't.Had Wolverine had only one or two instances where a gaping hole is shown through his abdomen and everybody looking around wondering, "Shouldn't he have a spine there?" but it never being shown, and then several more instances pass by which pretty much confirm, if not cement the fact that he doesn't have a spine... then you'd have an appropriate analogy.
That's not the case. So you don't.
Again, nice sh1tty straw-man. Welcome back.
Soooooo.... you mean, just like we've seen his sphenoid bone? Touch the side of your head just behind the orbital ridge. That is the sphenoid bone. It is what is behind the eye and joins the temporal and occipital bone groupings. It is what would need to be missing for him to get shot through the eye. It's not missing. We've seen it.
Oh wait that is different... because you like pretend it is...
Originally posted by srankmissingninShow me a scan that isn't a 1x1 inch panel of a laptop screen projection that shows crap and could show it being there or not.
Soooooo.... you mean, just like we've seen his sphenoid bone? Touch the side of your head just behind the orbital ridge. That is the sphenoid bone. It is what is behind the eye and joins the temporal and occipital bone groupings. It is what would need to be missing for him to get shot through the eye. It's not missing. We've seen it.Oh wait that is different... because you like pretend it is...
Oh wait... if it was so clear, you'd post it every chance you'd get. Now you're caught up in the true issue. Whether or not there is an equally supportable counter-argument based on comic book evidence. Not real life science notions that apparently comic books don't give two sh1ts about, much less me.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Show me a scan that isn't a 1x1 inch panel of a laptop screen projection that shows crap and could show it being there or not.Oh wait... if it was so clear, you'd post it every chance you'd get. Now you're caught up in the true issue. Whether or not there is an equally supportable counter-argument based on comic book evidence. Not real life science notions that apparently comic books don't give two sh1ts about, much less me.
Every them you have seen the side of Wolverine skull, profile or other wise, you are seeing the greater wing of the sphenoid bone. Is this really something that I need to show? That is the bone you think is missing. Clearly it isn't missing, we've seen the part of it that connects to the temporal dozens of times. I'm not sure what you don't understand. That bone is part of the side of the head, and then goes across the skull behind the orbital and joins the temporal on both sides of the head, houses part of the brain and the all the olfactory nerves. Are you having a hard time understanding that you can see the bone behind the eye every time you see the side of the head?
Originally posted by srankmissingninThe greater wing? Wtf are you talking about? I'm sorry, but there is a gap in the back of the orbital cavity where there ought to bone if Wolverine were a real life human (who isn't malformed anyway)..
Every them you have seen the side of Wolverine skull, profile or other wise, you are seeing the greater wing of the sphenoid bone. Is this really something that I need to show? That is the bone you think is missing. Clearly it isn't missing, we've seen the part of it that connects to the temporal dozens of times. I'm not sure what you don't understand. That bone is part of the side of the head, and then goes across the skull behind the orbital and joins the temporal on both sides of the head, houses part of the brain and the all the olfactory nerves. Are you having a hard time understanding that you can see the bone behind the eye every time you see the side of the head?
... but he's not. He's a fake comic book character feral mutant who has had the lack of a rear sphenoid bone (among other pieces) been used against him multiple times!
Fine, you know what. Let's do real life deduction. I build a god damn robot based on the human skeleton. I line it all with titanium. People try to shoot it, it never works, but a lot of times people try shooting it through cavities in the head. Somehow, the bullets get inside the skull.
You stand there saying, "You moron! If you really designed it to be a good human skeleton approximation, there wouldn't be gaps large enough anywhere!"
I say, "Oops. Phuck do I look like? A biologist?"
You say, "That's not fair!"
So? What? Is it still a fact that the robot still be shot in the head? Yeah. Until I fix it.
You're literally saying, "NO. It shouldn't have happened in the first place. So nobody mention that it did just happen multiple times... *BANG* DAMMIT, stop shooting it through the skull! It's not supposed to happen! *BANG* I said stop it! It's not supposed to happen, so it never did despite it happening AGAIN!"
Did it happen? Yes. Despite your protestations? Yes. Will it happen again? Yes, even when we were arguing this issue two years ago... it's been happening again while we were arguing over it.
Get over it. 😐
I don't understand why this is the issue, plenty of things happen in comics that don't make sense anatomically, scientifically, or physically. I mean characters like Punisher and Captain America are able to take abuse that transcends what a normal person should be. I believe Srank described Punishers durability as metahuman, which doesn't make sense anatomically seeing as he has normal bone structure and shouldn't be able to deal with half of the things he does.
This theory about whether or nor Wolverine has a bone (which very few people knew about to begin with) is silly. For one it's pretty obvious how Marvel sees the situation and it'd be a safe bet that sometime in the next year Wolverine is going to get taken out through that method again. However even if it is true, I'm not sure why it makes that much of a difference seeing and getting off such a shot against a prepared Wolverine would be pretty damn hard and without sometime of super accuracy it would make it difficult to argue this could be done for the majority.
Originally posted by snowdragon
Wolverine has been shot through the eye to through the brain, its not only possible but probable that sabertooth can too, though I dont see that happening with these 2.I think Sabertooth for the majority.
It's true he's been shot through the eye, presumably into the brain, but just because it's happened... should it? Because that's what we're attempting to figure right now....
This argument dictates that Wolverine has numerous physiological issues that he's never shown to have and it's based on a typical error in anotomy on the writers part... Some writers use this weakness to put Wolverine away when they can't think of a better way to do it, some writers don't acknowledge that it's a weakness at all. Some artists depict his eyes as gaping black holes, some artists care to show the bone in the rear of the eye.
Should we lend credence to something just because it's happened?
Because (and this is how this all got started) Captain America has punched out Hulk... Is it okay to use that showing in a forum argument?
Originally posted by Trackz
I don't understand why this is the issue, plenty of things happen in comics that don't make sense anatomically, scientifically, or physically. I mean characters like Punisher and Captain America are able to take abuse that transcends what a normal person should be. I believe Srank described Punishers durability as metahuman, which doesn't make sense anatomically seeing as he has normal bone structure and shouldn't be able to deal with half of the things he does.This theory about whether or nor Wolverine has a bone (which very few people knew about to begin with) is silly. For one it's pretty obvious how Marvel sees the situation and it'd be a safe bet that sometime in the next year Wolverine is going to get taken out through that method again. However even if it is true, I'm not sure why it makes that much of a difference seeing and getting off such a shot against a prepared Wolverine would be pretty damn hard and without sometime of super accuracy it would make it difficult to argue this could be done for the majority.
Wow this is an extremely reasonable post.
Again I think the real issue with this debate stems from the point that it simply happening is not enough of a reason to make it credible.
Sabretooth apparently ripped Wolverine's heart out over his ribcage/chestplate... does that mean Wolverine doesn't have one?
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
The greater wing? Wtf are you talking about? I'm sorry, but there is a gap in the back of the orbital cavity where there ought to bone if Wolverine were a real life human (who isn't malformed anyway)..... but he's not. He's a fake comic book character feral mutant who has had the lack of a rear sphenoid bone (among other pieces) been used against him multiple times!
Fine, you know what. Let's do real life deduction. I build a god damn robot based on the human skeleton. I line it all with titanium. People try to shoot it, it never works, but a lot of times people try shooting it through cavities in the head. Somehow, the bullets get inside the skull.
You stand there saying, "You moron! If you really designed it to be a good human skeleton approximation, there wouldn't be gaps large enough anywhere!"
I say, "Oops. Phuck do I look like? A biologist?"
You say, "That's not fair!"
So. What? Can that robot still be shot in the head? Yeah. Until I fix it.
You're literally saying, "NO. It shouldn't have happened in the first place. So nobody mention that it did just happen multiple times...
*BANG*
DAMMIT, stop shooting it through the skull! It's not supposed to happen!
*BANG*
I said stop it! It's not supposed to happen, so it never did despite it happening AGAIN!"
😐
What am I talking about? I'm talking about anatomy. Maybe "greater wing" isn't a clinical term, but I am an illustrator so my studies in anatomy have always been primarily artistic. What I can tell is that the sphenoid bone is a butterfly shaped bone that connects both sides of the skull to one another like a rafter running behind the front of the face. It is called "the greater wing" because it looks like a butterfly's wings (duh), and that is the portion of the bone that is visible on the side of skull.
Except it isn't like that at all. You have already established that you believe Wolverine has a spine in spite of the fact that he has the victim of some gruesome disembowelings that have gone straight through the center of his abdomen because we have seen his spinal cord. Well guess what? We have seen his sphenoid bone too. Not really open for debate or interpretation.
^ Stop throwing anatomical terms to invent a portion of a bone that clearly isn't possessed by a fake comic book character.
I've seen Wolverine's spine several times clearly. I've never seen his sphenoid bone clearly, your phantom scan notwithstanding. 99% of the world doesn't know or care about the sphenoid bone on humans. It has sh1t to do with how a comic book character is being portrayed consistently.
Originally posted by jinzinIt's exactly what we've been telling you. And I'm not going to argue it's easy to take Wolverine down. You still have to get the right angle on such a small opening. That takes incredible accuracy or skill.
Wow this is an extremely reasonable post.Again I think the real issue with this debate stems from the point that it simply happening is not enough of a reason to make it credible.
Sabretooth apparently ripped Wolverine's heart out over his ribcage/chestplate... does that mean Wolverine doesn't have one?
It happening repeatedly and it being confirmed/supported by character statements is enough.
Had Sabretooth reached directly through his sternum and people talking about how it would work, and us never really clearly seeing the sternum and the sternum being something that nobody but anxious Wolvie fans would know about (clearly not, but I'm painting a picture) then you'd have an appropriate analogy.
IT'S NOT THE SAME CIRCUMSTANCES. SO YOU DON'T.
Stop twisting this into something it's not.
Originally posted by jinzinWe know that if comic writers cared about real life human anatomy, it shouldn't. Nobody disputes that.
It's true he's been shot through the eye, presumably into the brain, but just because it's happened... should it? Because that's what we're attempting to figure right now....
But they don't. Shouldn't means sh1t in comics. Particularly shouldn't based on real life anatomy. Wolverine shouldn't have three claws or a healing factor or survive having his metal laced or not have his organs pulverized by Hulk's punch. You've got no problems with these comic book facts.
What's the problem here? Am I belaboring the obvious?