Marvel speed vs DC speed · Comic Book 'Versus' Forum

Parmaniac Evincar of KMC

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I agree with Thor and Thanos, but Surfer? He has a lot of speed feats. I say his speed is near if not on the level of superman.

I think most of these feats are "on board" feats and not "face to face H2H" feats, that's why he doesn't gives Surfer the super speed.

I once asked for a fighting super speed feat and someone posted a scan of Surfer on his board blasting stuff. So till today I personally haven't seen a single H2H Surfer super speed feat, maybe it's just me.

Dum Dum Dugan Senior Member

why does surfer keep being brought up as example of lacking speed feats. He has many speed feats and is a bad example. In fact he one of the few marvel characters who actually has speed showings in the ball park of DC upper level guys.

quanchi112 Disney

Originally posted by Philosophía
So physically moving his body, after percieving and reacting to a FTL opponent. Would you say that's not superspeed? Does Thanos need to run some "heartbeat laps" around the world for you to think he has superspeed?

I already told you how I see superspeed and reflexes as being different. I've answered your questions now answer mine which sums it up nicely.

Who is faster in terms of speed, fallen one or Thanos ?

Now the answer is obvious and in terms of speed it's not even close. Since you have to agree it's the fallen one then how do you feel since thanos has shown the reflexes to stop his attacks before they hit him ?

Dum Dum Dugan Senior Member

Originally posted by Parmaniac
I think most of these feats are "on board" feats and not "face to face H2H" feats, that's why he doesn't gives Surfer the super speed.
I once asked for a fighting super speed feat and someone posted a scan of Surfer on his board blasting stuff. So till today I personally haven't seen a single H2H Surfer super speed feat, maybe it's just me.

oh ok that makes more sense. However is not the board an extension of himself?

Oh that is true, I never really seen him use it h2h. But he more a range fighter anyways.

Omega Vision Face Flowed Into Her Eyes

Originally posted by Philosophía
Why wouldn't it be? Because they're not close in speed.

All three of those characters do possess durability to weather a blitz for some amount of time (debateable how long) as well as other powers that can level the playing field and unless we all drink the Combo-to-KO koolaid we must accept that if they can withstand a blitz long enough to use said powers they have the chance to win.

I'd agree wholeheartedly on the speed kills 10/10 argument but for the nature of the beast that is comics. We either have to call any instance of a slower character tagging a faster character PIS or accept that speed is not an end all be all advantage.

quanchi112 Disney

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
oh ok that makes more sense. However is not the board an extension of himself?
Oh that is true, I never really seen him use it h2h. But he more a range fighter anyways.

He used speed on his board to take on nova. With the board I feel he's one of the fastest characters in comics.

KuRuPT Thanosi Senior Member

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Jesus Christ Philo is this really that hard... Let's take the 100 yard dash... are you saying that everyone reacts to the gun at the exact same time with the exact same reaction speed? Or do they react differently? Just because someone reacts the fastest and gets off the line fastest doesn't mean he will win the race, In fact, it's usually the opposite. The person winning the race has the higher end speed (top speed) but not the fastest reaction time. The quick reaction time allows certain people to make the final and compete but they lack they higher end speed to win. It's really that simple. Now in a comic book format.. those reflexes that allowed the sprinter to compete now allows them to tag an opponent and possibly gain an advatage doing so. I'm not sure how you're saying they are exactly the same thing when clearly, even in real life, they are not.

Philosophía "The devil made me do it"

Originally posted by marwash22
To be clear, I'm not saying the slower character has "better reflexes", I'm saying the slower character's reflexes is what allows him/her to contend with the faster character. make sense?

Reflexes have to come with being able to percieve you're being attacked in the first place; reflexes have to come with being able to process that attack; and then physically moving your body to counter it; when we're talking about insane speeds like lightspeed, or faster than that (many people still don't seem to understand just how ridiculous being able to percieve things at lightspeed really is), you can't base it all on reflexes, and say that the character isn't close to the opponent in speed.

Allankles Kwisatz Haderach

Originally posted by marwash22
then how do you explain anyone ever hitting Wally? PIS?

Not necessarily depends on whether Wally expected it or saw it coming. He can be surprised and blind sided. If he's ready and facing his opponent h2h, his reflexes are way too sharp to get hit, even if he isn't zig zagging all over the place.

His perceptions are also on another level, giving him an added advantage, only Supes (outside the Flash family) has better perception in terms if motion tracking among the Earth heroes.

carver9 Senior Member

Originally posted by Philosophía
That's why we're not CBR. Characters don't knock eachother out in nanoseconds. And CIS still applies.
If Marvel fans would finally accept that the likes of Flash/Superman do indeed have the speed to take care of fights against the likes of Thor/Surfer and Thanos before they can react, the debates would be a lot more interesting.

WTF

Dum Dum Dugan Senior Member

It is interesting becuase certain character clearly seem to be able to travel much faster then they can react or fight. There seems to be clear difference between combat speed and movement speed with character such as for example Thor.

quanchi112 Disney

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
It is interesting becuase certain character clearly seem to be able to travel much faster then they can react or fight. There seems to be clear difference between combat speed and movement speed with character such as for example Thor.

Every character's travel speed is faster than fight speed imo.

Dum Dum Dugan Senior Member

Originally posted by Allankles
Not necessarily depends on whether Wally expected it or saw it coming. He can be surprised and blind sided. If he's ready and facing his opponent h2h, his reflexes are way too sharp to get hit, even if he isn't zig zagging all over the place.

Or could it be completely dependent upon how much of the speed force they are currently accessing. If there level of speed in DC they can reach is much higher, could not also there control be more complete?

The Line Restricted

Silver Surfer, Gladiator, and Thanos can all react at the speeds that Superman, Flash, ect can react. The problem comes in that they can't ACT at those same speeds. They will always be on the defensive against any DC speedster.

Dum Dum Dugan Senior Member

Originally posted by quanchi112
Every character's travel speed is faster than fight speed imo.

This is not true at all.

Nor to the level I am talking about.

Philosophía "The devil made me do it"

Originally posted by Omega Vision
All three of those characters do possess durability to weather a blitz for some amount of time (debateable how long) as well as other powers that can level the playing field and unless we all drink the Combo-to-KO koolaid we must accept that if they can withstand a blitz long enough to use said powers they have the chance to win.
I'd agree wholeheartedly on the speed kills 10/10 argument but for the nature of the beast that is comics. We either have to call any instance of a slower character tagging a faster character PIS or accept that speed is not an end all be all advantage.

I wouldn't say they posses the capability to weather a blitz for some amount of time. If Superman would blitz any of them (save perhaps Thanos), I'd give them 8 punches at best before they're going down. Would you say they're fast enough to counter before the 8 punches? If you do, then you go back to "they're close enough in speed" which is just not true.

Having microsecond reaction time alone implies you'll be able to spend relative weeks in a second. Wrap your head around a fight where one of the guys is able to do that. Now imagine that Superman has sported 1000 times that perception time. Now imagine again, that Barry is to a nanosecond, as the nanosecond is to a second.

If people would actually think about the implications that superspeed on this level has, they'd understand that there's just simply no way the likes of Superman/Flash would lose if they didn't want to.

quanchi112 Disney

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
This is not true at all.
Nor to the level I am talking about.

Name an example then.

Surfer and superman can travel much faster than they can fight at.

-Pr- Hey Yo!

Originally posted by leonidas
that's the thing--in threads it doesn't get past that. thor is ko'd in the first nano-second. as is any marvel guy. supes can do the same. to any marvel guys. even glads, mak, hell even runner's feats are nothing to flash. and those are the VERY best speedsters. therefore, it follows that speedsters will win. based on feats, they win EVERY time. if that's the case, so be it. hell, i love superman AND flash. it just seems awfully simplistic and seems to go against the nature of the characters, at times.

and that's fine. no fight should be settled purely on speed. the only problem, as i see it, is when people deny that a character had said speed, and thereby handicaps them to allow "their" character to win.

or by the same token, try to make the character they're up for seem like they're faster than they are.

Galan007 |Quantum Observer|

Originally posted by Philosophía
Having microsecond reaction time alone implies you'll be able to spend relative weeks in a second. Wrap your head around a fight where one of the guys is able to do that.

Or better yet, try wrapping your head around the guys who operate by the attosecond, and can spend a relative billions of years in a second.

It's just unreal.

TricksterPriest Renegade Timelord

Originally posted by Allankles
He was powering the engines btw. And the engines were powering the Mageddon weapon which was the size of a solar system. It was a shocking feat to his peers.
I used him because he was used as an example in this thread earlier. I'm not even arguing one way or the other with regards to strength and durability, I just disagreed with your generalizations and your insistence on planet busting, which would be considered a callous act by many DC heroes.

Bigger. Mageddon was overwhelming the horizon at a distance of light years.

Omega: I refer you to any thread Zoom is in. Speed does kill. If you can hit hard enough to hurt the opponent with your blows, and you're fast enough that they can't hit you.....they're kinda screwed.

And as shown in Marvel, speed wrecks telepaths too. Exodus got whupped by Quicksilver of all people. So if you can move faster than they can react, then how is speed not a crushing advantage?