Marvel speed vs DC speed

Originally posted by Philosophía
I wouldn't say they posses the capability to weather a blitz for some amount of time. If Superman would blitz any of them (save perhaps Thanos), I'd give them 8 punches at best before they're going down. Would you say they're fast enough to counter before the 8 punches? If you do, then you go back to "they're close enough in speed" which is just not true.

Having microsecond reaction time alone implies you'll be able to spend relative weeks in a second. Wrap your head around a fight where one of the guys is able to do that.

I've tried to imagine what it'd be like to be that fast. And the conclusion I always come to is that what should logically be the case and what is portrayed in comics are two different things. The one time this 'speed kills 10/10' argument is completely validated that I can think of is the example of Zoom.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
All three of those characters do possess durability to weather a blitz for some amount of time (debateable how long) as well as other powers that can level the playing field and unless we all drink the Combo-to-KO koolaid we must accept that if they can withstand a blitz long enough to use said powers they have the chance to win.

I'd agree wholeheartedly on the speed kills 10/10 argument but for the nature of the beast that is comics. We either have to call any instance of a slower character tagging a faster character PIS or accept that speed is not an end all be all advantage.

I never said this about you but this was a good a** post.

Originally posted by carver9
I never said this about you but this was a good a** post.

Edit: Don't think for a second I'm agreeing with you Carver. I'm just not of the same extreme view as Phil in this situation.

You're the opposite extreme and don't you forget it. uhuh

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Or could it be completely dependent upon how much of the speed force they are currently accessing. If there level of speed in DC they can reach is much higher, could not also there control be more complete?

There's definitely an under current of PIS with Flashes especially with regards to the problems they face physically from some of their rogues. However, as a counter to that stance, they are not infallible and they have been surprised or outmaneuvered with clever tactics on occasion.

You have to keep in mind that they don't benefit from the extra sensory powers that Supes enjoys, beyond super perception. So they can be surprised or blind sided by stealth etc.

For instance sound dampening an area to affect their hearing and using TK at the same time would be effective against them.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Name an example then.

Almost any elite street has better combat speed showings then traveling speed.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
😘

Originally posted by Omega Vision
8 punches? Really? That's a bit extreme. Unless you think Thor isn't at least comparable in durability to Superman I don't see Superman downing him with so few blows when he himself could more than stand up to that many blows and keep coming.

I've tried to imagine what it'd be like to be that fast. And the conclusion I always come to is that what should logically be the case and what is portrayed in comics are two different things. The one time this 'speed kills 10/10' argument is completely validated that I can think of is the example of Zoom.

Anyway, that's highly irrelevant. My point is that Superman could go home, read a book, feed Krypto, bang Lois and then come back to the fight, and Thor still wouldn't have percieved it to be started (as neither would have Lois!), if we actually take the perception time he's shown in comics. I'm not exagerating, if you actually take a closer look at what the level of speed he's capable of implies.

Even with the "reflexes" hilariousness, in the time it takes Thanos to lift a hand somebody like, say, Barry, would grow old and die in the relative time to him.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
wolverine, spiderman ect. There are loads of examples as DD, capt ect.

Almost any elite street has better combat speed showings then traveling speed.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Every character's travel speed is faster than fight speed imo.

And this is one of the main reasons I think Flash is one of the only characters that can actually fight at light speed.

Originally posted by carver9
You didn't show me anything. You showed me Zod and Supes fighting and about 10 people came in and told you that you were wrong. All of the feats you put up, you don't even know the context of them. Stop going to the respect thread and actually read the comics.

Show ALL of us someone from DC destroying a planet.

Originally posted by Allankles
There's definitely an under current of PIS with Flashes especially with regards to the problems they face physically from some of their rogues. However, as a counter to that stance, they are not infallible and they have been surprised or outmaneuvered with clever tactics on occasion.

You have to keep in mind that they don't benefit from the extra sensory powers that Supes enjoys, beyond super perception. So they can be surprised or blind sided by stealth etc.

For instance sound dampening an area to affect their hearing and using TK at the same time would be effective against them.

Originally posted by dmills
Ooh.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Also, guys, leave strength and durability out of this. there's a couple of people in this thread I was about to reply to (and possibly warn), but i'll just leave it at telling you all not to go off topic.

Originally posted by Philosophía
The opponent wouldn't be able to brace himself for the attack, and they'd come in quick succesion. You don't think that Thor standing there and Superman trying his best to knock him out, wouldn't be able to do it in 8 punches?

Anyway, that's highly irrelevant. My point is that Superman could go home, read a book, feed Krypto, bang Lois and then come back to the fight, and Thor still wouldn't have percieved it to be started, if we actually take the perception time he's shown in comics. I'm not exagerating, if you actually take a closer look at what the level of speed he's capable of implies.

Right. But then what do we do with all the fights where he doesn't absolutely rapestomp his slower opponent while whistling Carmen and preparing Crepes Suzette for Lois?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Ah, ok I can see what you are saying here but I still maintain those guys can probably run faster than they can fight it's just common sense.

Reason I first brought it up is becuase Thor movement speed is leagues beyond his combat speed. Superman is not nearly in the same boat. He still posses extremely high levels of combat speed but there are characters like thor who seems to have far greater kap between his movement speed and combat speed.

Originally posted by Uriel005
Marvel tends to be more specific in limitations and strength scale. DC goes for hyperbole which is why IMO their high ends in specific areas where they are said to be "the best" in their field tends to outclass Marvel in physical stats. Energy projection I'd lean towards marvel however. For example DC will have a brick like superman for example physically overcome/influence an abstract concept with raw strength or some physical means. Marvel will tend to have some mystic/psionic reason that is much more convincing even with suspension of disbelief in play.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
problem is comics dont fallow such things, And I disagree because I feel they have the ability to move a much faster speeds in bursts, but can't maintain nearly the same pace while runn to destination.

Look at any mma fighter in round 1 if he goes all out he won't have anywhere near the same tempo for round 2.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Right. But then what do we do with all the fights where he doesn't absolutely rapestomp his slower opponent while whistling Carmen and preparing Crepes Suzette for Lois?

Speed kills. People have to accept it so that we can move on.

nah, you simply need to realize that i don't need to be as fast as you, to punch you in the mouth.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You also can't fight at your fastest pace for long durations of time either.

Look at any mma fighter in round 1 if he goes all out he won't have anywhere near the same tempo for round 2.

Depends on the guys cardio, and also his weight class (to some extent). Super human stamina is part and parcel of these guys, some of them have fought consistently for days without ceasing.

Originally posted by Philosophía
Tehnically, they are PIS, but at the same time it's how comic stories work - and the writers themselves have directly admitted that logically those with Flash-level abilities should end fights in two panels. But that's the way it is.

Speed kills. People have to accept it so that we can move on.

Because that's what it is. There are more cases of Superman fighting a much slower opponent (and not necessarily holding back either) and NOT absolutely stomping them than the reverse.