I'd like to point out if you are going to say that 3 Jedi Masters were standing still because of how it LOOKED onscreen... , and then discount Sidious's victory because of it... you might be careful when you start using a comic book to prove someone else's abilities, all of his opponents look rather still as well....
And don't put "End of Debate" At the end of a single post. It is remarkably bad form.
SM
Kun has the amulets.
Opening post
Kun at peak of power, without Amulets.
Do I need to define "without" for you?
SM
They make him BA.
Yep, the source of Exar Kun's power: glorified Sith accessories. And you expect me to be impressed when Palpatine, Dooku, Vader and others don't need that shit?
SM
I don't care if you and your posse like it, he's a top tier Force user. End of debate.
RB
If only we determined canon based on what we liked.... You probably would have enjoyed the Janus-era a lot.
Welcome back, honey.
👆
I'll get to this later, promise.
Originally posted by truejedi
I'd like to point out if you are going to say that 3 Jedi Masters were standing still because of how it LOOKED onscreen... , and then discount Sidious's victory because of it... you might be careful when you start using a comic book to prove someone else's abilities, all of his opponents look rather still as well....And don't put "End of Debate" At the end of a single post. It is remarkably bad form.
Unfunny, dude.
(Me) Too Jedi:
Originally posted by truejedi
I'd like to point out if you are going to say that 3 Jedi Masters were standing still because of how it LOOKED onscreen... , and then discount Sidious's victory because of it... you might be careful when you start using a comic book to prove someone else's abilities, all of his opponents look rather still as well....
Firstly, movies = absolute highest canon. They are greater and truer sources than anything else.
Secondly, the master swordsmen and Jedi in question did almost nothing to defend themselves. Sidious overcoming them isn't a laudable feat because literally anyone in the series could have jumped forward and stabbed two Jedi who didn't lift a finger to save themselves.
A single source saying "Larry, Curly, and Moe Jedi Masters were uber among their Order or for all time, etc. lol" doesn't overwrite the fact that the fight with Sidious is their lowest showing ever.
And Kit Fisto himself was KO'd by Ventress in seconds in The Cestus Deception. Ventress = Sidious?
And don't put "End of Debate" At the end of a single post. It is remarkably bad form.
If you need to grab small details with your ankle-biting Me Too mentality, by all means, I won't condescend to tell you how to post. But don't preach down to me from a pedestal of morality. It doesn't work like that.
Flaccid Sidious Boner:
Do I need to define "without" for you?
You must have slept in, I'm sorry; let me refresh you - I brought up to NYR that clearly Kun can't be argued without his amulets because:
1. He always has them as a Sith. So they are always on his person.
2. They clearly make him more powerful, even if you just eliminate the amulet blasts themselves. LL brought up that usually the blasts themselves are removed, but not the amulets. So my argument stands.
I'd give you a blue ribbon for reading comprehension, but that would be like rewarding an F student.
Yep, the source of Exar Kun's power: glorified Sith accessories. And you expect me to be impressed when Palpatine, Dooku, Vader and others don't need that shit?
There's a reason they don't have that shit -- the Jedi spent millenia destroying the Sith amulets because they were among the most powerful of Dark Side artifacts. It's stated in the TotJ compendium. Considering the goal of a Sith is enhancing one's power base to maintain power, I'd say that the post-Ruusan Sith not having amulets is a huge strike against them and their standing. If Sadow's amulet is similar to most Sith Lords or even the top half dozen, this doesn't bode well for Sith who come after.
RB
If only we determined canon based on what we liked.... You probably would have enjoyed the Janus-era a lot.
Obvious misrepresentation of what I really did on a regular basis. But you're entitled to tee hee.
Originally posted by truejedi
not a joke. an observation. arguing "how things appear" isnt' a good route when your own source material is a comic book... Gideon and I discussed that before he died concerning DE.
???
Artwork is a critical aspect of the comic book format. Surely you aren't saying we should ignore an entire genera? Because that's what Gideon is after. The only things mainstream enough to be found in splatbooks are the events around the movies. If we ignore everything outside of that era, then Palpatine is hands down the most powerful Sith. Going by the other media available, however, it becomes less cut and dried. (Which he hates.)
I believe Sidious moved quickly enough that 3 high-ranking masters were unable to react. Fisto at least, has many strong saber showings.
At least, that's how it looked to me... onscreen... in the movie... the highest form of canon. Are you going to tell me that your interpretation of what you see onscreen is more important than my interpretation?
and please, suit yourself and put whatever you want at the end of your post, but remember you are convincing no one but yourself...
This anthropology final sucks so much I've mentally dubbed it "Kyle's Mom" for amusement purposes. Between KMC, my iPod, and DamnYouAutoCorrect.com, I'm tempted just to finish it tomorrow.
tj
I believe Sidious moved quickly enough that 3 high-ranking masters were unable to react.
👆
tj
Are you going to tell me that your interpretation of what you see onscreen is more important than my interpretation?
You obviously don't know him very well. 😂 That's exactly what he's going to tell you.
Originally posted by truejedi
I believe Sidious moved quickly enough that 3 high-ranking masters were unable to react. Fisto at least, has many strong saber showings.At least, that's how it looked to me... onscreen... in the movie... the highest form of canon. Are you going to tell me that your interpretation of what you see onscreen is more important than my interpretation?
and please, suit yourself and put whatever you want at the end of your post, but remember you are convincing no one but yourself...
I think more accurate might be something that he could pull off. (Advent's use of TPM is a good example of this idea.)
Z.
Surely you aren't saying we should ignore an entire genera?
If we set aside the fact that he didn't say anything like this, I'm pretty sure that's what he's getting at.
👆
Z.
Because that's what Gideon is after.
I'm pretty sure Gideon routinely references events, scans, and quotes taken from comics and has never supported wholesale dismissal of them. But you're pretty good at finding sources like the one that says Nihilus is as much of a dark side nexus as Palpatineso why don't you find where he said that, just for kicks or are you used to making claims you can never back up?.
Z.
The only things mainstream enough to be found
You're one of those emo guys who b1tch and moan about his favorite indie bands not getting a major record deal. Just stop. Are you really that butthurt over your boy only getting three reference pages in a book that should be all about him?
Z.
splatbooks are the events around the movies.
I forgot that sourcebooks are "lame" when they don't support you. What a rationalist you are. 😂
tj
i know, i just want him to say it, so i can quote it in every single thread for the rest of kmc's existence.
Give him time.
Actually, I demonstrated in my detailed RotS duel commentary that the sound of the pods' levitation devices was clearly audible and that he was using TK on the controls, not the entire weight of the pods themselves. This diminishes the feat considerably, considering Qui-Gon Jinn was able to use the Force on a small scale to manipulate droid innards to shut them down. Qui-Gon = Sidious? I think not.
I did not hear any sounds of levitation devices. Those pods were forcefully ripped out of there holdings. You can even see the sparks from them being ripped out. Sidious' hand signals also indicate that he was using the force to guide and direct the pod's directions.
I don't mind anyone making a case for why they might believe another sith to be on par with Sidious, as long as they make a good argument. But when you try to make false claims as to why Sidious was able to easily handle those pods when the scene proves otherwise, it just makes you seem desparate for another sith to outdo him. If Kun has a better TK feat then mention it, but don't try to downplay Sidious' feat in order to make Kun look better. Kapeesh?
Are you joking? If my favorite bands got a major record deal they would no longer be my favorite bands.
To continue the analogy, though, I do bytch and moan every time I hear someone say "Journey? That's that band the guy from Glee likes, right?"
Edit: Also, your musical tastes in this analogy is essentially that of a Hannah Montana fan.
Originally posted by Zampanó
???Artwork is a critical aspect of the comic book format. Surely you aren't saying we should ignore an entire genera? Because that's what Gideon is after. The only things mainstream enough to be found in splatbooks are the events around the movies. If we ignore everything outside of that era, then Palpatine is hands down the most powerful Sith. Going by the other media available, however, it becomes less cut and dried. (Which he hates.)
where did i say that? What I am saying is you can't make dismiss Sidious's feat of killing 3 master-swordsmen in seconds because to YOU it looks as though he wasn't moving very fast, when the people you ARE defending move only in still images. Cut the hypocrisy.
Originally posted by truejedi
I believe Sidious moved quickly enough that 3 high-ranking masters were unable to react. Fisto at least, has many strong saber showings.At least, that's how it looked to me... onscreen... in the movie... the highest form of canon. Are you going to tell me that your interpretation of what you see onscreen is more important than my interpretation?
and please, suit yourself and put whatever you want at the end of your post, but remember you are convincing no one but yourself...
0:38
Saber ignited. Note that the Jedi are already armed, meaning they expect resistance.
0:40
Initiation of flying attack. Note that attack is straightforward.
0:42
Sidious lands. He is about 2-3 feet from the foremost Jedi Masters. They had already raised their blades to a high guard in anticipation during his spiraling flight.
0:43
Sidious pulls back in a clearly telegraphed thrust.
0:44
Sidious spears a Jedi Master. On the screen, Tiin can clearly cleave Sidious in two. His weapon is high, he has is in perfect slicing distance, and Sidious is busy putting his entire saber through Agen. We see that he does raise his blade to strike but...
0:45
Sidious rolls his blade across, opposite of all of the Jedi, and then hits Tiin with a backhand.
0:47
Sidious completes his circuit and initiates a one-handed swipe to Kit Fisto. Note that Fisto did not try to attack before this, nor did Mace Windu.
0:47
After connecting with Fisto's guard, Sidious cuts high and is deflected by Mace Windu.
0:48
Sidious completes a circuit again, brings his blade up and unbalances Kit Fisto, and then pursues Mace.
0:49
Mace does a down cut to deflect Sidious' attack. He moves back a step before doing a circuit opposite of Sidious to cut horizontal. Heartbeat later, and we see Sidious coming high facing Fisto who is aiming midlevel now, attacking, while Mace Windu completes an unnecessary spin to cut at Sidious' back.
0:50
Sidious holds his blade vertical and both Mace and Kit hit it simulatenously. He dances backwards.
0:51
Mace has disengaged. Sidious completes his twirl and cleaves Kit Fisto in half, his guard hanging useless.
0:52
Cue Mace and Sidious shuffling down a hall.
Quite frankly, this is a low showing for everyone but Sidious. Clearly, there's three separate occasions where one of the Jedi could have engaged and spoiled Sidious' rush if not outright killed him. They had five whole seconds to actually respond to his clearly telegraphed and straightforward attack, but chose to raise their swords and die.
What did you see? Sidious moving faster than trained experts who capitalize openings and fought epically for their lives? A coherent battle plan enacted by Jedi who are trained to fight with lightsabers against a single opponent?
While it is true that in limited space, a single opponent may have advantages against many, in this case it's as if the Jedi didn't really try in earnest to even strike at him. Being caught flat-footed over that glowing red psycho crusher is embrassing. And considering how Jedi like Obi-Wan can destroy faster combatants like Grievous, this is especially disappointing.
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Sidious Fan 666
I did not hear any sounds of levitation devices. Those pods were forcefully ripped out of there holdings. You can even see the sparks from them being ripped out. Sidious' hand signals also indicate that he was using the force to guide and direct the pod's directions.I don't mind anyone making a case for why they might believe another sith to be on par with Sidious, as long as they make a good argument. But when you try to make false claims as to why Sidious was able to easily handle those pods when the scene proves otherwise, it just makes you seem desparate for another sith to outdo him. If Kun has a better TK feat then mention it, but don't try to downplay Sidious' feat in order to make Kun look better. Kapeesh?
You can CLEARLY hear the sound of the pods' levitation devices. Do me a favor and listen to them while you think up a reply. Kapeesh?