Gabriel Belmont vs. Kratos

Originally posted by Burning thought
But unlike Kratos he was not invulnerable to Gabriels attacks.

Kratos was never stabbed by anyone as weak as Gabriel or with a weapon as simple as a combat cross. Kratos has a feat, and its better than Gabriels, simple.

What Gabriel has done has nothing to do with durability though.

Kratos goes from using Olmypian power and gains power from the Titans, his following feats being far greater than previous ones.

Zeus and Ares are at least as strong as kratos, and this was before Kratos had the power of the Titans anyway, before GoW 3. [b]Gabriel has no strength to compare him to Zeus. He laughed off all the attacsk I mentioned, lets repeat them again; hephaeustus hammer, Poseidon crab horse creatures who could pull Titans, Chronos...

I have 3 claiming he is invulerable to something vastly stronger than a man with a sword, you have two where Gods at least equel to his strength at the time using godly weapons can cut him before his Titan power boost.

All this "avoid", but you cannot admit straight that Gabriel would be dead if the same happened to him, hes not strong enough. 😆 what basis do you have that Gabriel can resist for any time someone as strong as Chronos? absolutly nothing....

You cant try and fool me this time as I have played it, Cornell has no real feats to compare to Kratos or anything of note. I like how you miss out the fact that Kratos was not staked on a church steeple but was impaled by a spear tossed by the God of war from miles away...

"for a moment", he lifted it up after it could not damage him, it gives him strength equel to at least Chronos' arm which is greater than anything in strength and durability than Gabriel has ever done.

Well clearly you dont understand either of the games since you think Gabriel and a combat cross=Zeus, king of the gods wielding the blade that ended a titanic war, the difference in power that is required to kill Kratos who btw was probably at his weakest unlike now and what Gabriel has at his disposal is vast. [/B]

Kratos has never resisted anyone's piercing attacks but has been pierced into death more than once so you stating he can't be cut has no evidence to support it whatsoever. I also have gabriel cutting up someone resistant to the extreme temperatures of lava yet you claim Gabriel is weak. You really don't have a leg to stand on.

Gabriel doesn't win based off of durability he wins based off of outfighting the threats who get in his way. The guy isn't immune like Kratos isn't immune they need to outfight the bad guys.

Having greater feats doesn't mean greater power. Like I said using your logic if someone gains an amp but shows little to no feats before losing it this doesn't mean you are more powerful without the amp. I feel bad as you can't even see it. You have no idea what it is you are even arguing on a theoretical level.

How are Zeus and Ares as strong as Kratos ? Based off of which feats since you since so feat oriented. The point is they are strong enough to hurt/kill him like gabriel or any other baddie from the gow universe. Kratos outfights his opponents and anyone who can't see this shouldn't be trusted in comprehending any video game. Kratos didn't laugh off their attacks he resisted and killed them before they could do the same to Kratos. It's pretty clear Hephaestus affected him. Wow.

You don't have Kratos resisting a single piercing attack. You make another random abc claim and repeat yourself in a vicious circle.

The fact Gabriel resists stronger opponents in his own gamem and the fact it's only Cronos' hand and temporary. Either way it's speculative but either way we have Gabriel face much larger opponents he is strong enough to injure who are made of stone and dragon bone.

I never said he does have the feats Cornell shows up for one major boss fight. Cornell is implied in the game and it's obvious as a giant lycan he's incredibly strong but we can't prove how strong just get the idea the guy can easily swing a giant sledge hammer in combat and tear through flesh like butter. Kratos was stabbed right through and died by Zeus' sword. Kratos at the end kills himself or is so weak he can no longer fight depending on how they explain his either demise or return in the next game. Carmilla fought on showing despite the momentum of being staked right through her body she can fight on unlike Kratos ye you call her weak. Laughable.

No, it doesn't give him strength greater than Cronos' arm. I don't even get where you get this stuff. It's just nonsense after nonsense. He resisted a much stronger opponent for a moment to blind and elude him. That's it.

You don't have to be Zeus' level to hurt Kratos. That's the thing your mind can't understand and I think Gabriel would maul Zeus as well at the end of the dlc. Just too powerful. You didn't play the dlc so you are ignorant in this regard.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You haven't even proven Kratos is invulnerable to anyone's sword attacks let alone gabriel's. The horrendous thing is it won't get through to you.

Kratos has never resisted anyone's piercing attacks but has been pierced into death more than once so you stating he can't be cut has no evidence to support it whatsoever. I also have gabriel cutting up someone resistant to the extreme temperatures of lava yet you claim Gabriel is weak. You really don't have a leg to stand on.

Gabriel doesn't win based off of durability he wins based off of outfighting the threats who get in his way. The guy isn't immune like Kratos isn't immune they need to outfight the bad guys.

Having greater feats doesn't mean greater power. Like I said using your logic if someone gains an amp but shows little to no feats before losing it this doesn't mean you are more powerful without the amp. I feel bad as you can't even see it. You have no idea what it is you are even arguing on a theoretical level.

How are Zeus and Ares as strong as Kratos ? Based off of which feats since you since so feat oriented. The point is they are strong enough to hurt/kill him like gabriel or any other baddie from the gow universe. Kratos outfights his opponents and anyone who can't see this shouldn't be trusted in comprehending any video game. Kratos didn't laugh off their attacks he resisted and killed them before they could do the same to Kratos. It's pretty clear Hephaestus affected him. Wow.

You don't have Kratos resisting a single piercing attack. You make another random abc claim and repeat yourself in a vicious circle.

The fact Gabriel resists stronger opponents in his own gamem and the fact it's only Cronos' hand and temporary. Either way it's speculative but either way we have Gabriel face much larger opponents he is strong enough to injure who are made of stone and dragon bone.

I never said he does have the feats Cornell shows up for one major boss fight. Cornell is implied in the game and it's obvious as a giant lycan he's incredibly strong but we can't prove how strong just get the idea the guy can easily swing a giant sledge hammer in combat and tear through flesh like butter. Kratos was stabbed right through and died by Zeus' sword. Kratos at the end kills himself or is so weak he can no longer fight depending on how they explain his either demise or return in the next game. Carmilla fought on showing despite the momentum of being staked right through her body she can fight on unlike Kratos ye you call her weak. Laughable.

No, it doesn't give him strength greater than Cronos' arm. I don't even get where you get this stuff. It's just nonsense after nonsense. He resisted a much stronger opponent for a moment to blind and elude him. That's it.

You don't have to be Zeus' level to hurt Kratos. That's the thing your mind can't understand and I think Gabriel would maul Zeus as well at the end of the dlc. Just too powerful. You didn't play the dlc so you are ignorant in this regard.

You dont even understand how pressure works, its a shame you cannot even try and understand.

Cant be cut by Gabriel, not cant be cut. Cannot melt steel.

Well so does Kratos, difference is he also displays enormous strength and durability prowess at the same time.

Well it does, because in this case those feats show greater power so your clearly confused. It means the "amp" clearly was not much of amp, or was weaker than the next amp you get.

Zeus mandhandles Kratos on several occasions, Ares tossed an enormous spear miles across the land. You failed when you said "like Gabriel", Gabriel has nothing to compare to Kratos' opponents. Anyone who ignores every feat, has no knowledge of pressure and what piercing attacks are should not be argueing in this section and should go back to comics. Clear? how? show me? because iirc Kratos takes the hot hammer of Hepheastus in his hands and then repels it.

Nothing in Lords of shadow is bigger than Chronos, and nothing hits him with force similiar.

So your comparison is that Cornell can swing a giant hammer? 😆 , I would love to see Carmilla take a hit from Zeus with the blade of Olmypus, or a giant spike launced by Ares.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6wJUOCJrCo#t=0m29s

How do you propose he pushed Chronos' arm up if it was too heavy for him to lift? 🙄 , much stronger? clearly not that much if he can push his hand up and stand unharmed after thousands of tons of force, something Gabriel could not take even a fraction of.

I think your ignorance to both games, you clearly did not play GoW because your talking of Kratos as if he does not have a vast number of incredibly powerful feats that put him far above the damage capability of Gabriels tiny combat cross.

Kratos tanks a volcanic eruption that sent him hurtling for miles in a game (Ghost of Sparta) where he was weaker than he was in God of War 3.

Said eruption sunk Atlantis, Kratos was unscathed.

Again, how is Gabriel harming him again?

You say that, then we look at GoW 3 and see a Demi-God pulling a Gods head off as he struggles, squeezing anothers eyes out like Jelly, completly obliterating a Titan, etc etc etc, you overhype the titles of Gods and despite the source material toss around "size" as if it matters. I think it would take a special type of knucklehead to belive physical size was important in a game where one of the smallest, human sized characters can knock about those "tower sized" enemies with ease. I think being an Olympian has some perks, but I dont think Kratos' strength scales with his size, I dont think his size has anything to do with his strength unless yu think somehow his tiny frame has millions of muslces humans dont have or something? thats a hellava lot of claims. Maybe thats because hes 300 feet tall?

Yes, he pulled a God's Head off after he was crushed and tossed full speed into a side of a cliff by a giant pissed off walking mountain. And he beat Poseidon after Gaia punched him. And He didn't completely "Obliterate" the Titan. He wasn't going around judo slamming him or anything. He spends most of the time avoiding him and taking pot shots at him and the titan made a mistake by eating him. He did stop his hand full force which is impressive at that size, and it probably felt like a hand grip to Cronos but he still obviously has overall strength over Kratos at his normal human size.

No, it takes someone with a pair of eyes and common sense. Every time the Gods turned Giant mode in any fight it was portrayed as a way to get an advantage. All the Gods grew to their full size during their war against the Titans, Poseidon grew large as a way to fight them during the beginning of the game, Ares was 300 feet tall and Kratos had no way of fighting him without getting size himself, Zeus grew large in the first fight against him and we never take him head on.

Why would they grow in size and willingly make themselves bigger targets if it didn't bring any significant advantages during battle? Don't you think that if growing hundreds of times in size somehow didn't make them stronger or more durable that I would be considered an advantage to be smaller and harder to hit? And to the claim that "I dont think his size has anything to do with his strength" Come on now, seriously? Why do you think the titans are the ones that are able to hold mountains on their backs? Why do you think atlas has enough strength to support the planet? Because of their SIZE. Size does indeed matter.

Of course Kratos get's stronger when he grows in size. Hundreds of times stronger. More weight, more muscle mass. You are ridiculous.

I'll say it like this, if he faced cronos while giant sized he would man handle him.

^Kratos manhandled Hades even at full size and throughout the whole fight in general.

And Hades has the best outright strength feats of any of the Gods. (Barring Zeus who matched Kratos physically for a time)

Neither Poseidon or Helios had their bones weakened when Kratos was able to kill them with his barehands, they were just bleeding quite a bit and exhausted.

He was avoiding him during the ending of the fight.

On that 'giant spike launced by Ares', is this a weaker Kratos than in 2/3? Don't remember something that says he gets stronger besides his temp god status, so a tad confused..

Originally posted by Burning thought
You dont even understand how pressure works, its a shame you cannot even try and understand.

Cant be cut by Gabriel, not cant be cut. Cannot melt steel.

Well so does Kratos, difference is he also displays enormous strength and durability prowess at the same time.

Well it does, because in this case those feats show greater power so your clearly confused. It means the "amp" clearly was not much of amp, or was weaker than the next amp you get.

Zeus mandhandles Kratos on several occasions, Ares tossed an enormous spear miles across the land. You failed when you said "like Gabriel", Gabriel has nothing to compare to Kratos' opponents. Anyone who ignores every feat, has no knowledge of pressure and what piercing attacks are should not be argueing in this section and should go back to comics. Clear? how? show me? because iirc Kratos takes the hot hammer of Hepheastus in his hands and then repels it.

Nothing in Lords of shadow is bigger than Chronos, and nothing hits him with force similiar.

So your comparison is that Cornell can swing a giant hammer? 😆 , I would love to see Carmilla take a hit from Zeus with the blade of Olmypus, or a giant spike launced by Ares.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6wJUOCJrCo#t=0m29s

How do you propose he pushed Chronos' arm up if it was too heavy for him to lift? 🙄 , much stronger? clearly not that much if he can push his hand up and stand unharmed after thousands of tons of force, something Gabriel could not take even a fraction of.

I think your ignorance to both games, you clearly did not play GoW because your talking of Kratos as if he does not have a vast number of incredibly powerful feats that put him far above the damage capability of Gabriels tiny combat cross.

Gabriel also displays enormous strength to do the things he does as well. You mistakenly think Kratos is invulnerable to piercing when just the opposite has been proven more than 3 times in his games. These are just the ps titles as I am not familiar with the psp titles until they hit the ps3 later this year.

Zeus only successfully kills him when he lowers his power and has him store all the remaining in his sword after he defeats Colossus with it. Zeus is still strong enough to kill Kratos at full power yet gets beat and doesn't get the chance to do so.

I haven't ignored a single feat I have simply understood them. You ignore the piercing feats and just want to highlight the Cronos one as an attempt to suggest he's somehow immune to sword strikes based off of this abc logic. Apples and oranges I am afraid. Hephaestus electrocutes him and then Kratos kills him. It's that simple. Saying Hephaestus didn't hurt Kratos is simply not grasping the scene.

So with regards to Kratos' size it doesn't matter but when talking about Cronos size is everything. You argue even against yourself and your blatant doublestandards. The dragon titan is more than big enough to hurt Cronos since Kratos can despite being the size o fan ant.

Carmilla could since she can survive being staked on top of a castle and still fight.

We don't even know where Kratos was when his hand goes down and it's more of a gameplay mechanic because if you don't resist his fingers can easily crush Kratos if he doesn't resist.

I understand both games whereas you use double standards and continue to make no sense.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You need to prove Gabriel can't cut him but since there's no proof Kratos is resistant to swords or anything I will take that as a concession.

Gabriel also displays enormous strength to do the things he does as well. You mistakenly think Kratos is invulnerable to piercing when just the opposite has been proven more than 3 times in his games. These are just the ps titles as I am not familiar with the psp titles until they hit the ps3 later this year.

Zeus only successfully kills him when he lowers his power and has him store all the remaining in his sword after he defeats Colossus with it. Zeus is still strong enough to kill Kratos at full power yet gets beat and doesn't get the chance to do so.

I haven't ignored a single feat I have simply understood them. You ignore the piercing feats and just want to highlight the Cronos one as an attempt to suggest he's somehow immune to sword strikes based off of this abc logic. Apples and oranges I am afraid. Hephaestus electrocutes him and then Kratos kills him. It's that simple. Saying Hephaestus didn't hurt Kratos is simply not grasping the scene.

So with regards to Kratos' size it doesn't matter but when talking about Cronos size is everything. You argue even against yourself and your blatant doublestandards. The dragon titan is more than big enough to hurt Cronos since Kratos can despite being the size o fan ant.

Carmilla could since she can survive being staked on top of a castle and still fight.

We don't even know where Kratos was when his hand goes down and it's more of a gameplay mechanic because if you don't resist his fingers can easily crush Kratos if he doesn't resist.

I understand both games whereas you use double standards and continue to make no sense.

I dont, that my little ignorant buddy is called the burden of proof, I dont have to disprove/prove a negative claim. You have to prove he can. Look up concession, you cant take anything as a concession until I actually concede, considering you have zero evidence and ignorant of physics and the source material were supposed to be discussing thats not likely to happen. I suggest you thank me for the time I have wasted trying to teach you.

I will await for your video/official document evidence to counter the following:

-Chronos, Hephaustus, unarmed Zeus, Poseidon and pretty much any GoW opponent of note not strong enough to harm Kratos, they are all>>>>Gabriels feats therefore Gabriel cannot hurt him.

-Kratos has the strength to defeat their strength therefore his strength being in the thousands of tons give him an edge easily.

-His weapons cannot be dodged so easily, the hades claws can cover him with their attack, the blades of Chaos being chains strike a large area. Kratos also has a lot of powers, like Atlas quake, Helios head, medusas head that can ruin Gabriels chances of even making this fight worth having.,

Your ignorance of the source material means you should not really make these kinds of threads, especially when you dont really want to debate them, you just want to make claims, thats not a debate.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I haven't played the DLC for Castlevania (are there no Trophies? I still have 100% completion on my psn profile for the game), but I still think Gabriel would win. He has better combos and better powers. Fully upgraded at the end of the game he is almost unbeatable, ultimate light and ultimate shadow will even heal him from any damage he takes... plus in the context of the story isn't he completely immortal after the events of the game? Kratos dies all the time, he just comes back because luckily for him Hades has an open door policy for anyone even mildly talented at platforming.

Better combos. Lawlz. While believing that gameplay combos factor into this is ridiculous, it is also pointless, seeing as End-of-Game Gabriel (with the power of the Forgotten One), or Dracul, does not have the Combat Cross, his main weapon.

About the only thing in Gabriel's Arsenal that I see posing some sort of trouble to Kratos, is the Dark Crystal. Gabriel's 'Regen' should not be a problem for Kratos, and Kratos has abilities that are far more hax, in addition to being far superior physically.

Originally posted by BloodRain
On that 'giant spike launced by Ares', is this a weaker Kratos than in 2/3? Don't remember something that says he gets stronger besides his temp god status, so a tad confused..

Much weaker, at least when compared to peak Kratos from 2 & 3. He needed the power of Hope to go toe-to-toe with Ares, yet in 2, he survived an encounter with Zeus, and in 3, he killed Poseidon with his bare hands, & went toe-to-toe with Hades, without the power of Hope; at least, it wasn't active.

Army of Hades (GoW 1 ver.) is incredibly hax though.

Dont forget, Kratos gets boosted in power by the Titans in GoW 2, which is likely why he is so strong/durable now. Not sure why the Dark crystal would be a threat to Kratos? did it not just release a hawt succubus?

So that same throw wouldnt do the same? When was he got enhanced by them again?

Oh, and found concept art roughly showing what Atlas is under, which aint the whole Earth.

Though Kratos dominates this match. Portrayal wont be saving Gabriel.

Oh, and found concept art roughly showing what Atlas is under, which aint the whole Earth.

Ohh show plz

This one, from the lead concept artist. This pic shows Atlas' perch to be one of few supports, and is the only one not at the center. Think that big thing under the mountain might be holding it up too. Anyhow, doesnt seem like as much of the mass is upon him compared to the centered ones. /shrugs

Odd that the area looks nothing like that in the game. 😬

Originally posted by BloodRain
So that same throw wouldnt do the same? When was he got enhanced by them again?

Oh, and found concept art roughly showing what Atlas is under, which aint the whole Earth.

Though Kratos dominates this match. Portrayal wont be saving Gabriel.

not sure how much PSI was in that large piercing log compared to Chronos' slap.

I dont think he ever did, not that it matters because whatever Atlas is holding up, only requires him to hold a small area above him. Which makes sense assuming those other pillars and objects are present to aid him.

Only Chains of Olympus makes it very clear that without Atlas, the thing would fall.

Which means he is in fact holding most of it himself.

Originally posted by BloodRain
So that same throw wouldnt do the same? When was he got enhanced by them again?

Oh, and found concept art roughly showing what Atlas is under, which aint the whole Earth.

Though Kratos dominates this match. Portrayal wont be saving Gabriel.

Throughout GoW 2, he gets powers from various sources, mostly Titans, and eventually gets the Blade of Olympus from Zeus. He loses most of said abilities after the prologue of 3 (but I doubt his physical stats decrease in any way), and then gains new items and weapons throughout 3.

Hint: Concept art. It's called that for a reason.
The Underworld areas in the game(s) do not look exactly like that, and the place where Atlas stands is different from where he seems to be in that pic; but that is how the Earth in GoW is, i.e. Flat. So Atlas is not really holding up anything close to 6x10^24 kilos but the best guess we can have, is that it is approximately 1% of that.

Also, had the Pillar of the Earth been destroyed (what was holding up the World before, and what Atlas currently stands on), the World would have crashed down into the Underworld, and pretty much everyone would have died. Atlas stands atop the Pillar of the Earth after it is destroyed, so most of the mass of the World is on Atlas' arms & shoulders, and he's stated in-game to be holding the World on his shoulders.

So yeah, In-Game evidence > Concept art.

Though when he lost his god powers his physical stats returned to what they were. His body is probably stronger by 3 but I dont get how it increases in the short span from the begining of 2 to 3.

@You two: Well it is concept, so it does show the intent of what they wanted. Even the placements right, below the Island of creation thats at the edge of the world. Also saw a line saying the world would fall into chaos, not the whole thing literally falling.. but not bothered to serch for the script.
If Zues' quote about his mounting raising up then that large part in the pic would be its base and taking the bulk of the load with Atlas at the edge.

And about that <10^22, shouldnt the figue come from the part of the GoW 'world' he's lifting?

Atlas is holding up the mortal world from the very edge of it, because the pillar of the world is right under the island of creation, which is on the edge of the world.

That makes the strength feat even more great than if he was holding it up from the center.

edit: and yeah, that concept art is NOT to scale by the way (the three judges are colossus of rhodes sized, not bigger than a titan). nor is there an ocean above Atlas when there should have been.