Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Considering your past reliance on handbooks, I don't understand where this sudden vitriol towards them comes from.[Whatever. I'll wait for when you post the scan of the page preceding the one you're discussing.
Because I've learned my lesson?
I'll post the whole damn thing. That way you can see how far above them Death was.
Ok, so the question is, going by what you guys have said, is whether Beyonder wiping out death is still canon or not.
Now, I'll be honest, I know jack shit about Beyonder, so I have to go by what you guys tell me. From first appearances, it looks like continuity just wasn't adhered to, and we have two conflicting comics.
Ok, I did a quick google to read more about the guy, and it says he destroyed then resurrected Death. Anyone want to clarify that for me, please?
Originally posted by -Pr-
Ok, so the question is, going by what you guys have said, is whether Beyonder wiping out death is still canon or not.Now, I'll be honest, I know jack shit about Beyonder, so I have to go by what you guys tell me. From first appearances, it looks like continuity just wasn't adhered to, and we have two conflicting comics.
Ok, I did a quick google to read more about the guy, and it says he destroyed then resurrected Death. Anyone want to clarify that for me, please?
It said so in a Handbook entry referencing events during SWII when Beyonder was the most powerful being in existence.
Later he was retconned into merely being half a cosmic cube, with Molecule Man being the other half. They merge and the new being is called Kosmos. That's the person Kubik is giving a tour of the universe for.
As they ascend the various levels of creation, she mentions that she's encountered these beings in her previous existence (as the Beyonder).
Kubik tells her no, they were just shadows of the real beings the great powers of the multiverse used to ease you into awareness. Then he mentions how they are insignificant to them.
Notice who is on the next level of existence? D E A T H.
Originally posted by Galan007
*see the OHOTMU entry I posted on the last page.*
Oh ok.
Originally posted by zopzop
It said so in a Handbook entry referencing events during SWII when Beyonder was the most powerful being in existence.Later he was retconned into merely being half a cosmic cube, with Molecule Man being the other half. They merge and the new being is called Kosmos. That's the person Kubik is giving a tour of the universe for.
As they ascend the various levels of creation, she mentions that she's encountered these beings in her previous existence (as the Beyonder).
Kubik tells her no, they were just shadows of the real beings the great powers of the multiverse used to ease you into awareness. Then he mentions how they are insignificant to them.
Notice who is on the next level of existence? D E A T H.
I fail to see how any of that contradicts what Galan is saying.
Originally posted by -Pr-
I fail to see how any of that contradicts what Galan is saying.
Kosmos says she's encountered these beings before in her previous existence as the Beyonder, Kubik tells her no she only encountered shadows of their true self because the great powers of the multiverse wanted to ease her into awareness.
The Beyonder never killed Death, beat the Celestials up, or cowered the great powers of the multiverse. It was all an act to ease him into awareness.
Originally posted by Galan007
He's saying that it wasn't the 'real' Death Beyonder erased/recreated -- even though Death's OHOTMU entry says it was. 😕
Oh, okay.
Then no, I have to go with what you said. A handbook alone isn't evidence, but they can be used to backup on-panel statements. In this case, the evidence that I can see is both more specific and definitive.
Originally posted by zopzop
You want to use that blast that the Maker unleashed on Thanos to make her seem more powerful than Tyrant?Want to compare that to Thanos' fight vs Tyrant? All because of one blast? Why didn't she blast him like that again? Maybe she tired herself out, because he went on to own the sh|t out of her. Deflecting her blasts, shielding against her blasts, blasting her to her knees. Even Skeet got in a hit and survived the Maker's counter attack.
She didnt blast him like that again because she was sabotaging herself!
Its right there on panel; she's losing it and having a nervous breakdown...thats the ONLY thing that allowed Thanos to have success against her/it. Your scans fully support my argument.
When she wasnt her own worse enemy, she took Thanos out with one simple eyebeam (from one eye at that); Tyrant was incapable of that kind of power output even when using both hands and again when clenching up with Thanos and blasting him with the attack that leveled his base.
And your speculation that her initial attack on Thanos made her tired is baseless; there is NO indication that that attack had drained her (it was a lone eyebeam from a single eye) in any significant way...
The fact of the matter is that the Maker attacked Thanos far less forcibly in the rematch than it did initially...
The Maker/Post Retcon Beyonder made very short work of Thanos when it wasnt having a mental meltdown very easily; this is something DP Tyrant was not able to accomplish...
Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
She didnt blast him like that again because she was sabotaging herself!Its right there on panel; she's losing it and having a nervous breakdown...thats the ONLY thing that allowed Thanos to have success against her/it. Your scans fully support my argument.
When she wasnt her own worse enemy, she took Thanos out with one simple eyebeam (from one eye at that); Tyrant was incapable of that kind of power output even when using both hands and again when clenching up with Thanos and blasting him with the attack that leveled his base.
And your speculation that her initial attack on Thanos made her tired is baseless; there is NO indication that that attack had drained her (it was a lone eyebeam from a single eye) in any significant way...
The fact of the matter is that the Maker attacked Thanos far less forcibly in the rematch than it did initially...
The Maker/Post Retcon Beyonder made very short work of Thanos when it wasnt having a mental meltdown very easily; this is something DP Tyrant was not able to accomplish...
No read the scans again. Thanos said that her taking mortal form made her vulnerable. That's it. He survived her best, then put her down. Look at Skeet! Even she took the fight to the Maker AND survived!
Fact remains, that she COULD NOT put Thanos down and in the end he wound up winning (blocking her attacks, deflecting her attacks, putting her down to her knees. Maker was even forced to block an attack from Skeet and couldn't kill Skeet).
Originally posted by zopzop
No read the scans again. Thanos said that her taking mortal form made her vulnerable. That's it. He survived her best, then put her down. Look at Skeet! Even she took the fight to the Maker AND survived!Fact remains, that she COULD NOT put Thanos down and in the end he wound up winning (blocking her attacks, deflecting her attacks, putting her down to her knees. Maker was even forced to block an attack from Skeet and couldn't kill Skeet).
Compare the maginitude of her initial attack on Thanos to the rest of them; you have the scan...its no contest...that initial attack contained far more punch than her attacks on Thanos later on and the one that Skeet survived.
And surely you are not arguing wether the Maker was having a meltdown or not...
Thanos beat a mentally incompetent Maker...you really want to use that as your counter argument as wether or not the Maker/Post Retcon Beyonder was more powerful than DP Tyrant?
Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Compare the maginitude of her initial attack on Thanos to the rest of them; you have the scan...its no contest...that initial attack contained far more punch than her attacks on Thanos later on and the one that Skeet survived.And surely you are not arguing wether the Maker was having a meltdown or not...
Thanos beat a mentally incompetent Maker...you really want to use that as your counter argument as wether or not the Maker/Post Retcon Beyonder was more powerful than DP Tyrant?
Well considering the fact that she was having a "MENTAL" breakdown and Oracle beat her earlier by shutting down her MIND. This has no bearing on her power output.
Thanos was blocking, deflecting, and shielding against her attacks this time she didn't take him by surprise.
