Originally posted by carver9An IMP is Flash punching at near lightspeed... So someone who can easily move ftl can't punch more than once in a second... Alrighty then I guess I have no choice but to concede now as this argument is irrefutable as clearly unlike the Hulk the Flash cannot do two things at once such as move really fast and punch at that speed (despite the fact that his punch speed is just his speed so it's really just repeating one motion) like the hulk can jump and clap.
Are you really arguing that Hulk can't clap while in the air? That's different than an imp. He is CLAPPING.
Hm lets see, just after a look at the Silver Surfer respect thread, we can see:
* Warp Speed
* Intangibility
* Teleportation
* Time Travel
* BFR via Location Portal and Time Portals
* Manipulation of Space and Time
* Create Illusions
* Telepathy
That's not even half of it, but are some which Hulk has no defense for.
I find it amazing fanboys can claim a brick can beat someone this versatile in a non-PIS battle. The picture people are painting is that Surfer is just some guy who just flies around firing off energy blasts.
Originally posted by Placidity
Hm lets see, just after a look at the Silver Surfer respect thread, we can see:* Warp Speed
* Intangibility
* Teleportation
* Time Travel
* BFR via Location Portal and Time Portals
* Manipulation of Space and Time
* Create Illusions
* TelepathyThat's not even half of it, but are some which Hulk has no defense for.
I find it amazing fanboys can claim a brick can beat someone this versatile in a non-PIS battle. The picture people are painting is that Surfer is just some guy who just flies around firing off energy blasts.
It's because we argue characters, not powersets 😛
but yes, in any reasonable fight Surfer should beat Hulk.
Originally posted by -Pr-
It's because we argue characters, not powersets 😛
It is within his character though (again bar PIS), where else did the feats come from?
I'll just say Surfer did not join the ranks of high heralds by being someone who just flies and fire a few hand blasts. I'll dare say if people don't think it is within his character to fight with his other powers in a NON-PIS fight then Surfer should be demoted to mid-herald at best. Not that I agree with that, but that would be your true contention.
Originally posted by Placidity
It is within his character though (again bar PIS), where else did the feats come from?I'll just say Surfer did not join the ranks of high heralds by being someone who just flies and fire a few hand blasts. I'll dare say if people don't think it is within his character to fight with his other powers in a [B]NON-PIS
fight then Surfer should be demoted to mid-herald at best. Not that I agree with that, but that would be your true contention. [/B]
le smiley = me kidding.
there's a question of consistency in general, so not every single application of his power is likely to be used in a fight, but he has more than enough versatility that IS consistent to both put him at high herald and make him a match for hulk in general.
Originally posted by Placidity
Hm lets see, just after a look at the Silver Surfer respect thread, we can see:* Warp Speed
* Intangibility
* Teleportation
* Time Travel
* BFR via Location Portal and Time Portals
* Manipulation of Space and Time
* Create Illusions
* TelepathyThat's not even half of it, but are some which Hulk has no defense for.
Lets look at your list. Teleportation? Can score him a BFR. "Location portal/time portal"? Another BFR. Time travel? Good for another BFR i suppose. Create illusions? Yeah thats a fight winner right there. Telepathy? Given that WWH nosold Professor X and a normal Hulk recently did the same to Xemnu doesnt seem like a great option. Intangibility could help Norrin hide I suppose but i dont think you are going to win a fight from an intengible state. Warp speed? Again i suppose Norrin can always run away if he wants. Good for him. Manipulation of space and time is pretty vague and sounds very menacing but im not sure what it means in a fight.
So basically this list doesnt ammount to much in the way of options other than BFR. Meanwhile Surfer could probably sit in orbit and blast this Hulk with his most powerful attacks all day to no effect. If people thought WWH had a ridiculous healing factor it doesnt bear thinking the sort of things this guy would bounce back from. Not to mention if we are to do a similar trawl through continuity to find obscure powers this is someone who has shrugged off transmutation in probably his weakest incarnation.
I find it amazing fanboys can claim a brick can beat someone this versatile in a non-PIS battle. The picture people are painting is that Surfer is just some guy who just flies around firing off energy blasts.
Well the reality is that thats who he is in 99% of his appearances. I realise people have some deep seated aversion to the Hulk because of Carver or whatever it is but the fact is that these guys would be ****ed 9/10 times in this fight.
Originally posted by -Pr-
le smiley = me kidding.there's a question of consistency in general, so not every single application of his power is likely to be used in a fight, but he has more than enough versatility that IS consistent to both put him at high herald and make him a match for hulk in general.
Its probably because forums such as this were heavily influenced by CBR back in the distant past but for whatever reason it was once accepted by most forum people that a character could use any ability that they had ever used, no matter how rarely over the years and the only reason they didnt use it in a particular fight was because of "PIS". That kind of approach seems to favour guys like the Surfer much more than other characters and is probably why hes seen as being much more effective and powerful online then he is in an actual comicbook. I think the obvious fact is that for most writers the Surfer [i]is[/] someone who just blasts things and flies around on a board and he isnt thought of as being capable of doing any and every feat that has been attributed to him by other writers over the years. I suppose thats just the way things are but the urge by people in battle forums to rewrite things "the way they ought to be" often goes way too far IMO. End rant.
Originally posted by Fifthchild
Lets look at your list. Teleportation? Can score him a BFR. "Location portal/time portal"? Another BFR. Time travel? Good for another BFR i suppose. Create illusions? Yeah thats a fight winner right there. Telepathy? Given that WWH nosold Professor X and a normal Hulk recently did the same to Xemnu doesnt seem like a great option. Intangibility could help Norrin hide I suppose but i dont think you are going to win a fight from an intengible state. Warp speed? Again i suppose Norrin can always run away if he wants. Good for him. Manipulation of space and time is pretty vague and sounds very menacing but im not sure what it means in a fight.So basically this list doesnt ammount to much in the way of options other than BFR. Meanwhile Surfer could probably sit in orbit and blast this Hulk with his most powerful attacks all day to no effect. If people thought WWH had a ridiculous healing factor it doesnt bear thinking the sort of things this guy would bounce back from. Not to mention if we are to do a similar trawl through continuity to find obscure powers this is someone who has shrugged off transmutation in probably his weakest incarnation.
Well the reality is that thats who he is in 99% of his appearances. I realise people have some deep seated aversion to the Hulk because of Carver or whatever it is but the fact is that these guys would be ****ed 9/10 times in this fight.
Surfer's blasts are powerful enough to KO the Champion, and in his fight with Morg they devastated an entire solar system with their energy output -- to assume that they would have "no effect" on Hulk is foolishness. Likewise, Hulk's resistance to transmutation was against someone whose abilities are so quantitatively and qualitatively inferior to Surfer's that the feat means almost nothing here, especially as in that comic hulk took pages to fully recover -- even though he regained mobility, he was still slow and stony. Surfer has evolved an entire planet with his matter manip, and has even affected Lunatik in a lasting way, who also has a massive healing factor.Some folks have suggested that Armageddon tried and failed to gamma drain hulk and that therefor it would be the same with Surfer, but this is simply not true -- Armageddon manipulated Hulk's energy to use it as a weapon against the people hulk loved, and he succeeded. Hulk bore through the attack and killed him, but the fight shows precisely the opposite of what some have claimed: it shows that hulk's gamma energy can be manipulated by an outside force.
Surfer solos ten ways 'til sunday.
Originally posted by Simbon
Some folks have suggested that Armageddon tried and failed to gamma drain hulk and that therefor it would be the same with Surfer, but this is simply not true -- Armageddon manipulated Hulk's energy to use it as a weapon against the people hulk loved, and he succeeded. Hulk bore through the attack and killed him, but the fight shows precisely the opposite of what some have claimed: it shows that hulk's gamma energy can be manipulated by an outside force.Surfer solos ten ways 'til sunday.
Ouch.