Originally posted by zopzopExcept when he didn't.
Meh Franklin could have owned them. 😉
Originally posted by zopzop
Hey they retreated after that one beam attack. They fused and went on to own Galactus. See where I'm going with this 😛
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Youmayobviously have forgotten that the entire Council of Reeds was actively fighting those Celestials during that scene. It wasn't as if Reed was by himself and drove off every single Mad Celestial on his own.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Except when he didn't.
Depends on how you look at it. One of the mad Celestials attempted to kill Franklin with concussion beams, and he warped the blast into harmless flowers. Then he caused more flowers to begin sprouting from another Celestial's head. What was the Celestial's first reaction? Well, we see a giant exclamation point suddenly appear above his head. So, yeah, Franklin actually did own them from my perspective Did he defeat them though? Obviously not. It was only round 1.
Like I said before, following Franklin's initial counterattack, the Celestials resorted to a cheap psychological tactic, entering his mind with the intent of frightening him off by implying that he will live forever, only to see his loved ones perish. Clearly, that bothered Franklin to an extent. And how did he react? He expelled the psychic attack from his mind! Yes, the ordeal shook him up a bit, but he definitely stood his ground. Now, the adult Franklin is back; and I've got a hunch that he's got something special in store for the space gods. He may even team up with his younger self.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ In other words, Franklin lost.
Not at all when you look at the bigger picture. Franklin set out to buy the others time (not destroy the celestials) and he was successful in doing so. How much time did they need? 28 minutes or so? Success.
Also, the celestials tried to kill him, (clearly uttering words like terminate or something to that effect) with their initial attack; and they failed.
That said, in my opinion, Franklin comes out on top here.
Originally posted by Galan007
Meaning they didn't know he was capable of warping reality at that point. Had they known that, their initial tactic would have likely been much different.
They seemed to know he was "beyond Omega level" prior to their attack though. That's what made them initiate the attack in the first place. So I doubt the approach would be much different.
Originally posted by DoonI'm pretty sure you can be classed as an omega+ without having a reality altering powerset--Iceman, Vulcan, and Mr. Immortal, for instance.
They seemed to know he was "beyond Omega level" prior to their attack though. That's what made them initiate the attack in the first place. So I doubt the approach would be much different.
Either way, Frank's reality manipulation surprised the Celestials, so they obviously had no clue. After finding out about that little tid-bit, they rapidly opted to switch offensive tactics. /shrug
I feel Hickman may use alternate reality Celestials to be comparable to 616 Celestials and that Marvel is retconning Celestials power-wise. After all, in the Thor #306 letters page, editorial explicitly stated Celestials are more powerful than Galactus and Watchers. But It's clear that Hickman intended Galactus to be more powerful than the norm based on his eating 4 planets ahead of time, but regardless of whether alternate reality Celestials are in the 616 Celestial ballpark, we see that 4 of them can decisively beat an amped Galactus. On the other hand, Franklin was able to stalemate them for a while. Hmmmm, I wonder if any of the 616 Celstials will collide with it's counter part.
Originally posted by Doon
Not at all when you look at the bigger picture. Franklin set out to buy the others time (not destroy the celestials) and he was successful in doing so. How much time did they need? 28 minutes or so? Success.Also, the celestials tried to kill him, (clearly uttering words like terminate or something to that effect) with their initial attack; and they failed.
That said, in my opinion, Franklin comes out on top here.
Originally posted by Galan007
I'm pretty sure you can be classed as an omega+ without having a reality altering powerset--Iceman, Vulcan, and Mr. Immortal, for instance.Either way, Frank's reality manipulation surprised the Celestials, so they obviously had no clue. After finding out about that little tid-bit, they rapidly opted to switch offensive tactics. /shrug
Fair argument. My point, though, is that they recognized Franklin as a serious threat and immediately sought to eliminate him. Regardless of them being clueless or not about the true nature of his powers, they failed in their initial attempt to kill him with concussion beams. On a side note, I'm a little surprised that they "had no clue" of Franky being a warper. I always imagined the celestials as all-knowing. Go figure.
Originally posted by lilshogun
But It's clear that Hickman intended Galactus to be more powerful than the norm based on his eating 4 planets ahead of time, but regardless of whether alternate reality Celestials are in the 616 Celestial ballpark, we see that 4 of them can decisively beat an amped Galactus. On the other hand, Franklin was able to stalemate them for a while...
That's an interesting way that you juxtaposed those two confrontations. Galan by all means stalemated the team of Celestials until they formed Voltron. In fact he went on the offensive and actually "killed" one of them. They obviously deemed him a significant threat to them as individuals and reacted accordingly.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ In my opinion, Galactus was winning... considering he tanked them attacking him simultaneously and defeated one of them without looking like he was significantly diminished in any proportional way, e.g., drained 25%.
Exactly, and thus the need to augment themselves. So with that said one has to wonder why someone would play up the Franklin encounter, but turn around and implicitly downplay the Galactus encounter?