Superman vs WBH-To the Death

Started by psycho gundam52 pages

Originally posted by -Pr-
Him crashing in to a moon (which is more a durability feat according to some) is the best striking feat you've seen from him? Not killing Doomsday, breaking Darkseid's arm, one-shotting heralds at various times, or splitting a moon?
well, superman wanted to destroy the shadow moon, not just split it, and it required him to slam into it really hard instead of punching it, so Im left to think he had to do so to get the desired result (that was supported by his thought processes to accomplish it)

Even if you lump them together he has two attacks that damaged celestial bodies, one was him not holding back to do it, hence him getting hurt pulling it off which means he can't do it in quick succession, and the full speed one doesn't look like it would be enough.

Im just trying to ascertain the potency of a speed blitz as Thwy just seem like a bunch of normal punches instead of really powerful ones he'd need to gain something here.

Even if you cut the effect of hulk and betty hitting eachother in half, doomsday and a large part of the earth would be mist

Hulk dying when the planet exploded and it is considered a high feat (eventhough matter is considerably lighter where it happened); While Superman gets briefly knocked out craahing near lightspeed to obliterate a moon and it is considereed a low feat.

Originally posted by Diesldude
Hulk died when the planet exploded and it is considered a high feat (where matter is considerably lighter). Superman gets briefly knocked out craahing near lightspeed to obliterate a moon and it is considereed a low feat.

Do you have scans of Hulk dying because it showed the blast going off and Hulk tanking and still fighting without a scratch inside of the blast.

Originally posted by Stoic
A 3rd less than Thor's considering Sav Hulk having to amp in order to rise to base class 100. Thor initially is a good deal stronger than Savage Hulk as is Bi Beast. You understand now right. Thor is stronger.

My point was to show that in your own estimation, superman is way beyond WBH. I was just correlating this with what we agreed with earlier. 🙂

Originally posted by carver9
Do you have scans of Hulk dying because it showed the blast going off and Hulk tanking and still fighting without a scratch inside of the blast.
cmon carver i have the issue, dont let me pull out scans. LOL The wishing well resurrected everyone including WBH. why do we have to do this again?

P.S Your quick response to my post kinda proves what I was trying to say. Superman's low showing that hulk fans keep bringing up is actually greater than WBH high end feat. LOL

Originally posted by psycho gundam

Im just trying to ascertain the potency of a speed blitz as Thwy just seem like a bunch of normal punches instead of really powerful ones he'd need to gain something here.

I don't know what "Thwy" stands for.

I don't even really know what "HOTM" stands for.

In regards to the speed blitz, however, I'm wondering the same thing.

IF it WERE to be used, how effective would the punches be?

For the hardest puncher I can think of, one stronger than Superman himself, and stronger by far, was not very effective when he tried to "blitz" punch people and it's not generally an effective technique in real life, either.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
I don't know what "Thwy" stands for.

I don't even really know what "HOTM" stands for.

In regards to the speed blitz, however, I'm wondering the same thing.

IF it WERE to be used, how effective would the punches be?

For the hardest puncher I can think of, one stronger than Superman himself, and stronger by far, was not very effective when he tried to "blitz" punch people and it's not generally an effective technique in real life, either.

The Flash says hi. 🙂

Superman goes intangible and rips hulk's heart out in a nanosecond.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Superman goes intangible and rips hulk's heart out in a nanosecond.
I don't think he needs to go intangible. He rips out the hulks heart before hulk can react. Like in that old crossover, where he used superspeed to grab that miniature device from behind the hulk's ear that was making him insanely angry.

.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
well, superman wanted to destroy the shadow moon, not just split it, and it required him to slam into it really hard instead of punching it, so Im left to think he had to do so to get the desired result (that was supported by his thought processes to accomplish it)

Even if you lump them together he has two attacks that damaged celestial bodies, one was him not holding back to do it, hence him getting hurt pulling it off which means he can't do it in quick succession, and the full speed one doesn't look like it would be enough.

Im just trying to ascertain the potency of a speed blitz as Thwy just seem like a bunch of normal punches instead of really powerful ones he'd need to gain something here.

There's also the point that this was done by a scribe that admitted to nerfing Superman in his books.

I don't know, tbh... The shadow moon feat is nice and all, but it's not generally considered one of his best.

As far as his speed-blitz punches go, i suppose it varies really.

Originally posted by -Pr-
There's also the point that this was done by a scribe that admitted to nerfing Superman in his books.

I don't know, tbh... The shadow moon feat is nice and all, but it's not generally considered one of his best.

As far as his speed-blitz punches go, i suppose it varies really.

he is also punching speedsters in that scan, which kinda negates the speed advantage. No?

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
I know the Hulk's strength is dynamic, what I'm saying is, the best we've SEEN from him on panel, is not better than the best we've SEEN from Superman. That's not even debatable. Yeah, maybe the Hulk's strength could go past Superman's (assuming there is anything he can lift that beyond infinite weight I guess), but I've yet to see it, and I've read a ton of Hulk comics, and by and large enjoy them. I just don't make him out to be a trans character like some people.

You're basically giving us the textbook definition of the no-limits fallacy. I'm going to ask you a question, and don't take this the wrong way, I'm just wondering how much physical damage, if any, you believe WBH could take before he is killed.

Do you think Odin, just amping his strength only (a la Zeus) could physically beat the WBH to death?

If not, do you think that, say a guy like Infinity Man, Thanos, or GA Superboy prime, or PC Superman could beat him to death?

i.e., if WBH just sat there and let Odin, or Infinity Man, or Thanos, or PC Captain Marvel could beat him down, would he ever die IYO?

@ Stoic
I'm not trolling you or anything but I would really like to hear your response to these direct questions. You seemed to sort of dodge em. Just want your opinion. Or any Hulk supporters who want to tackle these questions.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Superman goes intangible and rips hulk's heart out in a nanosecond.
Based on ?

Originally posted by Damborgson

It would since he wasn't actually striking the planet itself. But I have my doubts about the feat. Not to discredit it since thats impossible as it's it's incredible anyway you put it. Two people slam into each other and a planet explodes. There's no getting around that, but what doesn't make sense at all to me is that an issue later an even stronger pair of Hulk and She Rulk take direct STOMPS on the Earth and don't really damage it to the point that it endangers the Earth.

Was the planet on the Dark Dimension smaller? Or was there something going on in the dark dimension that made the feat more possible than on Earth? It doesn't add up to me is all.

Well the discrepancy you are referencingg has more to do with writer lapse/inconsistency than the dark dimension. For instance even while on earth, the mere footsteps of a holding back World Breaker were threatening the entire continent of North America (which is on earth) repeatedly and this was even one of the plot points surrounding the character as he was too dangerous to be on earth. Hence if the mutated giant hulk at the end was actually stronger then his repeated stomps should have caused at least as much damage or quite frankly much more. The problem here then isnt with the Dark dimension since the same discrepancy you talked about happens on earth as well

IMO a possible way to reconcile this is to simply not make the assumption that the huge mutated Hulk at the end of the series was stronger than WorldBreaker as he appeared before, seeing as even a holding back WBreaker on earth did outperform him featwise and how it was never mentioned that he was stronger anyway. Remember that WorldBReaker as he appeared on earth as well as WorldBreaker as he was in the dark dimension were as a result of Hulk letting lose with his anger and no longer holding it back in. Conversely the huge mutated Hulk appeared at a period where Hulk had already powered down from his WorldBreaker levels but then swallowed those gamma missiles fing fang foom was shooting at him. It is also not a normal function of Hulks powerset for him to baloon in size which suggests that some added mutation may have been going on. This added mutation from the gamma missiles was also seen in the cases of She hulk and Abomb as well so id say in your example the problem definitely does not lie with the Dark dimension

Regarding the Dark Dimension, Paks portrayal of it seemed to differ from some of its older portrayals seeing as it was portrayed pretty much like a run of the mill planetary body as opposed to an abstract dimensions with warped time, space, and perceptions. Using antiquated and differing previous portrayals of the Dark Dimension to cast doubt on the veracity of the World Breaking feat seems to be reaching and nitpicking quite a bit in my opinion (Heck even if we were to assume that the planet was like 5 times weaker or something the fact that it was done as a function of the residual shockwave would still make it far greater than regular planet busting)

Furthermore even then, the most impressive part about the feat in the Dark dimension was the destruction of hulks previous peers and even superiors as well as the army of mindless ones portrayed powerfully enough to take out Umar, via the residual shockwave of a single collision of punches. That part is the part of the feat that gives us a direct indication of the strength elevation that took place (exponential strength increase) and takes precedence ahead of the "space cheese".

Originally posted by Diesldude
cmon carver i have the issue, dont let me pull out scans. LOL The wishing well resurrected everyone including WBH. why do we have to do this again?

P.S Your quick response to my post kinda proves what I was trying to say. Superman's low showing that hulk fans keep bringing up is actually greater than WBH high end feat. LOL

He didn't die and that wasn't Superman in the scan that was hitting Flash, that was Prime. What am I going to do with you? WBH stomps and stomps hard.

Hulk's footsteps were shaking/damaging the eastern seaboard.

The eastern seaboard=/=the entire continent. Just saying.

g_troll

Originally posted by Galan007
Hulk's footsteps were shaking/damaging the eastern seaboard.

The eastern seaboard=/=the entire continent. Just saying.

g_troll

I agree but that strength ft alone puts him above most as well. Casual footsteps, not even Prime was pulling off fts like that. The strength gap is enormous, especially when you can crack a planet just by walking through a city.

Originally posted by Galan007
Hulk's footsteps were shaking/damaging the eastern seaboard.

The eastern seaboard=/=the entire continent. Just saying.

g_troll

True, but Im sure u get the point as if you can take 3 steps and sink the eastern seaboard then you walking around is definitely a threat to the entire continent.