Originally posted by dadudemon
The re-write was in two forms: first half is superman and the second half was Goku. Both are true. 😐
I know that it was in two forms. That wasn't what I was referring to.
What version of Superman are you talking about? Because if you mean comic Superman, then you're way off base on some of those points.
Originally posted by -Pr-
I know that it was in two forms. That wasn't what I was referring to.What version of Superman are you talking about? Because if you mean comic Superman, then you're way off base on some of those points.
So Superman does not creepily disguise himself as Clark Kent in the comic book version? He also does not have technology that surpasses the main-public's technology that could be used for the betterment of mankind, in general? He also is not a good moral person? He doesn't use his super powers to stalk the entire planet (listens in for danger and situations...makes use of his X-ray vision, etc.)? And, yes, Superman is generally self-righteous. A very irritating character trait that is supposed to be a recurring theme.
If so, then, sir, you are not reading Comic Book Superman and, instead, have confused Superman for a different character.
Whats creepy about him wanting to live the life he's been living since he was a child?
What technology? He has access to Kryptonian technology, sure, but it's never been stated that he could cure any major disease with it. Betterment of mankind? Howso?
He is a good, moral person, yes.
He listens to the world, yes, but only in a very general sense. He doesn't eavesdrop on conversation. It's like listening for a scream in a crowd; you don't hear anything you're not supposed to be hearing. X-ray vision? No, not unless he has to.
Self-righteous in what sense? That he believes what he's doing is right?
I read Superman every month, across all of his books.
Originally posted by -Pr-👆
Whats creepy about him wanting to live the life he's been living since he was a child?
What technology? He has access to Kryptonian technology, sure, but it's never been stated that he could cure any major disease with it. Betterment of mankind? Howso?
He is a good, moral person, yes.
He listens to the world, yes, but only in a very general sense. He doesn't eavesdrop on conversation. It's like listening for a scream in a crowd; you don't hear anything you're not supposed to be hearing. X-ray vision? No, not unless he has to.
Self-righteous in what sense? That he believes what he's doing is right?I read Superman every month, across all of his books.
Superman's technology is a double edged sword. It can be used for the bettermen of mankind but it can also be used to **** shit up. He is right keeping it away from mankind's filthy hands.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Whats creepy about him wanting to live the life he's been living since he was a child?
What's creepy about him masquerading as a weak human that acts timid, has poor balance, and all the other things he is actually not? What is creepy about a forced dissociative identity disorder? Oh, nothing at all.
Originally posted by -Pr-
What technology? He has access to Kryptonian technology, sure, but it's never been stated that he could cure any major disease with it. Betterment of mankind? Howso?
Yeah, pretty much the Eradicator, alone, makes you wrong. And Kelex seems to be able to create cures for even extremely potent diseases. Do you remember when Superman got the xarxas virus?
That's some 24th Century Star Trek level shit.
Originally posted by -Pr-
He is a good, moral person, yes.
He listens to the world, yes, but only in a very general sense.
It is still invasive and creepy as hell. His self-righteous attitude justifies his doing this...but it still does not make it any less creepy or invasive.
Originally posted by -Pr-
He doesn't eavesdrop on conversation. It's like listening for a scream in a crowd; you don't hear anything you're not supposed to be hearing.
Sorry, that's not how it works. You can claim he doesn't pay attention to it but he literally pays attention in order to pick up those screams you mention. He has used it for creepy endeavors in the past such as listening in on stuff Lois has said. There's no way you can justify what he does as anything less than invasive and creepy: Superman just has the benefit of almost always using it for good...generally.
Originally posted by -Pr-
X-ray vision? No, not unless he has to.
Self-righteous in what sense? That he believes what he's doing is right?
That he believes he is righteous and his decisions are righteous...such as holding back technology that could really improve the human condition.
Originally posted by -Pr-
I read Superman every month, across all of his books.
But you forgot about really important details that makes all of your rebuttals wrong. I haven't read Superman in ages and I can remember some important things.
You know what that really tells me? You do remember and are ignoring those because you do not like my very much valid and spot-on criticisms of Superman's character.
Originally posted by dadudemon
What's creepy about him masquerading as a weak human that acts timid, has poor balance, and all the other things he is actually not? What is creepy about a forced dissociative identity disorder? Oh, nothing at all.Yeah, pretty much the Eradicator, alone, makes you wrong. And Kelex seems to be able to create cures for even extremely potent diseases. Do you remember when Superman got the xarxas virus?
That's some 24th Century Star Trek level shit.
It is still invasive and creepy as hell. His self-righteous attitude justifies his doing this...but it still does not make it any less creepy or invasive.
Sorry, that's not how it works. You can claim he doesn't pay attention to it but he literally pays attention in order to pick up those screams you mention. He has used it for creepy endeavors in the past such as listening in on stuff Lois has said. There's no way you can justify what he does as anything less than invasive and creepy: Superman just has the benefit of almost always using it for good...generally.
That he believes he is righteous and his decisions are righteous...such as holding back technology that could really improve the human condition.
But you forgot about really important details that makes all of your rebuttals wrong. I haven't read Superman in ages and I can remember some important things.
You know what that really tells me? You do remember and are ignoring those because you do not like my very much valid and spot-on criticisms of Superman's character.
How does Superman have any sort of multiple personality disorder?
The Eradicator? Really? The single biggest reason why Kryptonian technology can get WAY out of control, is a reason why they should share technology? Not to mention how much of that has been retconned.
The xarxas virus almost killed Superman, and it was only through the fluke of Bizarro, iirc, that they were able to come up with a cure at all. And it was a Kryptonian disease, not a human one.
How is it invasive to listen for screams or calls for help? He's not digging in to people's personal lives any more than a good samaritan.
I disagree; It is how it works almost all of the time. Lois is only a special case because of how much trouble she gets herself in to. Random Joe in Cleveland isn't having his privacy invaded by Superman any more than Billy in Gotham or Bob in Coast City.
Why should he give humanity technology in the first place?
I haven't forgotten anything. I just don't agree with your assessment. You say I'm ignoring them, which is in itself a false assumption. I can disagree and have as much validity to my point as you do to yours. To you, it's valid. To me it isn't.
Originally posted by -Pr-
How does Superman have any sort of multiple personality disorder?
"What's creepy about him masquerading as a weak human that acts timid, has poor balance, and all the other things he is actually not? What is creepy about a forced dissociative identity disorder? Oh, nothing at all."
Originally posted by -Pr-
The Eradicator? Really? The single biggest reason why Kryptonian technology can get WAY out of control, is a reason why they should share technology? Not to mention how much of that has been retconned.
Yeah, that one machine that just so happens to posses the sum-total of Kryptonian knowledge. That other stuff is irrelevant. How is curing most diseases could "get out of control."
Originally posted by -Pr-
The xarxas virus almost killed Superman, and it was only through the fluke of Bizarro, iirc, that they were able to come up with a cure at all. And it was a Kryptonian disease, not a human one.
Every single point you made is irrelevant to the point I made. The point I made was ridiculous disease was cured through Kryptonian technology that humans do not posses. It does matter what the attack vector was, the incubation requirements, etc. What matters is it was a very deadly disease that was able to be cured with "24th Century Star Trek level shit."
Originally posted by -Pr-
How is it invasive to listen for screams or calls for help? He's not digging in to people's personal lives any more than a good samaritan.
Simple: one is passive the other is active.
Originally posted by -Pr-
I disagree; It is how it works almost all of the time. Lois is only a special case because of how much trouble she gets herself in to. Random Joe in Cleveland isn't having his privacy invaded by Superman any more than Billy in Gotham or Bob in Coast City.
Translation: "That is how it works, man, except when it doesn't work that way."
Not only is that pretty much irrelevant to my actual point, it directly proves you wrong.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Why should he give humanity technology in the first place?
Your question is very much malformed and it does not fairly represent my point. Context is key.
What I said was this: "That he believes he is righteous and his decisions are righteous...such as holding back technology that could really improve the human condition." That "technology" was a direct reference to what I had said, earlier, here:
"...has the technology to save mankind from many illnesses, problems, and diseases."
Granted, the wording could lead one to believe that "problems" means something other than medical science but I can clarify, now, and say that I was only referring to the medical science by problems. For example, a knee injury that greatly reduces mobility. That is not a disease but it is a medical problem that many humans face. Kel certainly has the technology and resources to assist man with those types of problems. His medical technology is superior, in some ways, to what 24th Century Star Trek has.
Originally posted by -Pr-
I haven't forgotten anything.
I agree. That's why I said this:
"You do remember..."
Originally posted by -Pr-
I just don't agree with your assessment.
I know because I said this:
"...you do not like my very much valid and spot-on criticisms of Superman's character. "
Originally posted by -Pr-
You say I'm ignoring them, which is in itself a false assumption.
You are ignoring some of the actual points I made and I pointed it out in this post when you did.
Originally posted by -Pr-
I can disagree and have as much validity to my point as you do to yours. To you, it's valid. To me it isn't.
You can only disagree with the morality of the points, not the points themselves. That does not make much sense, probably, so I'll better explain:
Superman holds back technology from humans: fact. You cannot disagree with this.
The point of contention is whether or not he should hold back technology from humans. I say it is self-righteous of him to do so in some cases such as awesome medical technology. You probably disagree. However, you disagreed for irrelevant reasons because you think I meant giving the technology to make crazy scary machines and AI like Eradicator.
Superman directly explores two personalities: fact. You cannot disagree with this.
I find it mildly creepy and you do not. That is something I cannot change about your opinion nor you mine.
Superman stalks people and actively invades privacy: fact. You cannot disagree with this.
We disagree on whether or not he is justified or it is for the greater good.
Yes they did, especially the recreation. It is obvious, after looking at the numbers and in a real stuation, that superman wins.
Just pick your most creative way in which he could win.
I realized a new one recently, with his laser beams. Not so long ago I didn't know it has the power to burn a planet.
Originally posted by COOLALLdayI'm sorry to say but the spirit bomb doesn't even enter the equation because the spirit bomb doesn't hurt people who are pure of heart, and everyone knows that superman is every bit as pure as goku.
I know that Superman draws energy from the sun but can't Goku just draw energy from the sun too and create a spirit bomb strong enough to obliterate Supes and if the sun isn't enough he can take energy from the rest of the universe as well until it is strong enough
Originally posted by juggermanCome on fighting may be goku's greatest passion and it may be what he lives for but protecting innocent people and the people he cares about will always come first, hell how many times has he been prepared to sacrifice his life to save the world or universe. Goku cares about innocent life so much that even the lives of animals is as valuable as any other, seeing a bird die pushed him over the edge and turned him into a super saiyan when he was fighting Cooler, heck he even offers his greatest enemies a chance to change and a chance to live. So make no mistake fighting may be his passion but protecting innocent people who cannot defend themselves is what he has dedicated his life to, and is why he trains himself and others.
He mostly fights to get stronger and test his ablities. Sure he saves the world but i think the 1st part is more important to him