Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Supergirl is fast enough and stronger, she also has ranged attacks, she should win.
Monica is faster than Supergirl, but she was easily chased down by Proxima's spear, and nearly killed. Based on how the spear works Supergirl had better not be hit by it, because it would probably kill her faster than it was killing Monica.. No one really knows just how strong Proxima is, but I wouldn't place her below the Class 100 mark.
Originally posted by Golgo13
Can Proxima withstand the Red energy SG will be spewing?
Who can tell if Proxima could outright tank the Plasma Wretch attack from a Red Lantern, but how would Supergirl take to being skewered by that spear? Like I said, Supergirl would need to get in quick and hit her until she started hearing squishy noises coming from Proxima's face. If not, and she fought in character, she could be killed by that spear attack. Proxima is a murderer, Supergirl isn't.
Originally posted by Stoic
Monica is faster than Supergirl, but she was easily chased down by Proxima's spear, and nearly killed. Based on how the spear works Supergirl had better not be hit by it, because it would probably kill her faster than it was killing Monica.. No one really knows just how strong Proxima is, but I wouldn't place her below the Class 100 mark.Who can tell if Proxima could outright tank the Plasma Wretch attack from a Red Lantern, but how would Supergirl take to being skewered by that spear? Like I said, Supergirl would need to get in quick and hit her until she started hearing squishy noises coming from Proxima's face. If not, and she fought in character, she could be killed by that spear attack. Proxima is a murderer, Supergirl isn't.
The red energy can be pretty haxxed. Atrocitus tore a hole through time and space. She can also form force fields and I think all the intelligent wielders can form constructs as well.
Come on dude, Supergirl just got the ring, she isn't really all that experienced with it yet. Atrocitus is another story, we can't use his feats to allow Supergirl to shine any brighter than she already is in this thread. This fight could go either way, but in order for Supergirl to pull a majority she would have to go in slightly out of character. The Girl Scout cookie shit, would have to be squashed.
Originally posted by Stoic
Come on dude, Supergirl just got the ring, she isn't really all that experienced with it yet. Atrocitus is another story, we can't use his feats to allow Supergirl to shine any brighter than she already is in this thread. This fight could go either way, but in order for Supergirl to pull a majority she would have to go in slightly out of character. The Girl Scout cookie shit, would have to be squashed.
It comes from the same power source and doesn't work like the GL rings, so it's all about hate. You'll have to find some examples of Proxima's durability feats to prove that she can take both the power of SG or the red lantern energy to say she can tank it.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
SG wins.Yes, Spectrum was hit by the spear, but as a counterpoint, a Wakandan soldier and Cap out reacted it, so on average, it's a street level weapon in terms of speed.
Or plot got into the way of a sensible outcome. Unless of course you believe that Cap and any other street can move faster than light. I don't have any idea how you came to the median that you did, but it's a pretty poor estimation. Supergirl wins nothing, she has nearly no experience with the red ring, nor is there any proof that she would survive the spear. Saying that it moves at under 60 MPH is pretty dumb tbh.
Originally posted by Stoic
Or plot got into the way of a sensible outcome. Unless of course you believe that Cap and any other street can move faster than light. I don't have any idea how you came to the median that you did, but it's a pretty poor estimation. Supergirl wins nothing, she has nearly no experience with the red ring, nor is there any proof that she would survive the spear. Saying that it moves at under 60 MPH is pretty dumb tbh.
You have one showing to prove your viewpoint (hitting Spectrum).
I have two (soldier, Cap).
I have more proof on my side to suggest that in fact, hitting Spectrum was PIS.
There were three main showings of PM:
1. attacking Wakanda;
2. attacking New York; and
3. the final battle.
In 1, she was pierced easily by a normal spear (remember, Wakanda has no more vibranium) thrown by Shuri, and her own spear was intercepted by a soldier.
In 2, she was beating on Cage until he found heart, then, she was unable to put him down (and was getting frustrated). She also wtfpwned Spectrum.
In 3, she took out the Hulk, along with Corvus, and then her spear was once again intercepted by Cap.
On average, so taking the sum of all of her showings, what makes you think she has the durability/speed to contend with SG?
Captain America has plot armor, he took a hit from Gambit that was able to put the hurt on Gladiator. Don't tell me that you don't realize how comic writers become idiots when it comes to Batman, and Captain America? Captain America KO'd the Hulk, while the hulk has had full out wars WARS... WARS with Thor, and guys that would one shot kill someone with Captain America's physical stats.
Cage was hurt when he fought her, he was hurt bad, and even said that he had broken ribs from the confrontation. Cage was also able to one shot the Rhino who happened to be a Class 80-85. In other words, Cage has been written up, above what anyone thought that he was in the past. If he can one shot KO a Class 80-85, what does that make him?
Spectrum was trying to outrun the spear. Are you trying to say that she was moving below 60 MPH? Please tell me that this is what you're trying to say to me here. If so, this will be my final post on the issue. You can then move along, telling yourself that Monica can not move faster than Captain America, Captain America without PIS has the ability to KO Class 100s, and tank more damage in either physical or energetic assaults that would put down guys capable of taking full on hits that could destroy planetoids. By all means you do that.
Originally posted by Stoic
Captain America has plot armor, he took a hit from Gambit that was able to put the hurt on Gladiator. Don't tell me that you don't realize how comic writers become idiots when it comes to Batman, and Captain America? Captain America KO'd the Hulk, while the hulk has had full out wars WARS... WARS with Thor, and guys that would one shot kill someone with Captain America's physical stats.Cage was hurt when he fought her, he was hurt bad, and even said that he had broken ribs from the confrontation. Cage was also able to one shot the Rhino who happened to be a Class 80-85. In other words, Cage has been written up, above what anyone thought that he was in the past. If he can one shot KO a Class 80-85, what does that make him?
Spectrum was trying to outrun the spear. Are you trying to say that she was moving below 60 MPH? Please tell me that this is what you're trying to say to me here. If so, this will be my final post on the issue. You can then move along, telling yourself that Monica can not move faster than Captain America, Captain America without PIS has the ability to KO Class 100, and tank more damage in either physical of energetic assaults that would put down guys capable of taking full on hits that destroy could destroy planetoids. By all means you do that.
Cool.
I know exactly what you're trying to say about Cap's plot armour, and agree. Except for the Wakandan soldier. So we have two extremes here, one, a famous named hero stepping up to the plate and taking it to the big bad, and two, a random no name little guy also doing the same.
I am trying to say that Spectrum was going at full speed, and the spear caught her at full speed, and that was merely an outlier PIS feat to showcase how badass PM was. Known as the Worf effect.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheWorfEffect
Stop trying to twist my words, and make out that I am trying to make the Spectrum scene as her going at slow speeds.
As I said before, hitting Spectrum was an outlier feat outside of her norm.
Do you have any further proof to show the speed of this spear? I currently have two. You have one. You call my examples PIS, I can easily say your ONE example is PIS.
Right because the spear was meant to move at very slow speeds, and it's not powerful at all. I mean it only placed the weight of an entire star on the Hulk, and yet it was incapable of killing off a human Soldier, and it couldn't tag Captain America. Then again Captain America is about as durable and fast as the Flash if the plot calls for him to be, oh and let's not forget about his Class 100 durability and strength that defies his description. Captain America should have been killed in his confrontation with the Black Order, but once again that plot armor came through in a pinch. It's the same thing that happened with Batman and the Spectre.
So you have a choice. You can believe that her weapon is weak, which I can assure you that it is not, you can believe that she is weak because of the Luke Cage variable, which I can also assure you that she isn't, and we can both wait until Thanos is once again freed, and the Black Order is back in action. Isn't Korvus back alive? If the spear can catch Monica, it certainly will catch Supergirl IMO.
Originally posted by Stoic
Right because the spear was meant to move at very slow speeds, and it's not powerful at all. I mean it only placed the weight of an entire star on the Hulk, and yet it was incapable of killing off a human Soldier, and it couldn't tag Captain America. Then again Captain America is about as durable and fast as the Flash if the plot calls for him to be, oh and let's not forget about his Class 100 durability and strength that defies his description. Captain America should have been killed in his confrontation with the Black Order, but once again that plot armor came through in a pinch. It's the same thing that happened with Batman and the Spectre.So you have a choice. You can believe that her weapon is weak, which I can assure you that it is not, you can believe that she is weak because of the Luke Cage variable, which I can also assure you that she isn't, and we can both wait until Thanos is once again freed, and the Black Order is back in action. Isn't Korvus back alive? If the spear can catch Monica, it certainly will catch Supergirl IMO.
No, no, its weight is not in question here, nor is its power. The human soldier was able to intercept it with his body, shout out, and then died (i.e I never said it was incapable of killing him off). It's its speed that I am calling into question.
With Batman/Spectre, completely different thing. Spectre said that he ALLOWED Batman to do what he did, to make him feel better. If PM said the same thing (I dialled my spear's speed down so Cap can look good) I missed that.
What are you basing your assertions and assurances on? Handbooks? Because I am using actual comic book showingS. Not just one showing, but 66% of her showings.
I am NOT saying the spear is weak, I am saying it is slow.
This is all we see.
https://imageshack.com/i/0553i3j
And before this...Cap already had his shield at his side.
