Originally posted by Psychotron
Another great rebuttal.
No what's a GREAT Rebuttal is you Ignoring ALL of your points being thoroughly REFUTED time and time AGAIN, with ALL OF THE EVIDENCE against you, but then just saying "Doesn't matter because Obi-Wan cut Maul's SABER LULZZZ."
But just to Destroy your points AGAIN, I'll break down the last point you made on the subject AGAIN:
Originally posted by Psychotron
Come on now, Obi-Wan wasn't off balance, Maul simply won that saber lock.
And he clearly threw him Off-Balance by winning the Saber Lock.
Originally posted by Psychotron
Again, using a FORCE push to win your fight doesn't make you a better duelist.
AGAIN You could EQUALIZE their Force TK Abilites, and Kenobi still would have been hit. Because he's the One who was Off-Balance, and left Open to a Force Push.
That is because Maul was simply the Superior combatant, Even After Kenobi was in a rage and trying to Avenge Qui-Gon, and Even After Kenobi was out of the fight for such a long time, he may as well have had a Nap. Even after all that, Maul still won the direct Saber fight, because Maul was still the Better Combatant.
Because AGAIN Force pushes are a basic part of Jedi/Sith Saber fights.
If Kenobi only Fell AFTER attempting to block the Force push, THEN AND ONLY THEN would you have a point.
Originally posted by Psychotron
However, destroying your opponents weapon, putting him on his ass,
You want to count WHO dropped/lost grip of their weapon more times, and WHO got put on their ASS more times, despite the fact that Kenobi had help from a Superior Jedi to himself for the Vast majority of the fight?
Originally posted by Psychotron
and cutting him in half, even though he had plenty of time to react, does.
Yeah except the fact that Maul had absolutely no idea Kenobi had a weapon until it was too late.
I.e. It was a completely Surprise attack.
But yeah you just miss out simple things like CONTEXT and like THE FACTS and stick to your Great Argument of "BUT HE CUT HIS WEAPON AND SLICED HIM IN 2 LULZZZZ!!!!"
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Don't be silly KT.Kenobi was no match for Maul in TPM. In fact he wasn't even Qui-Gon's equal yet. The novel makes that clear. Which is why he wasn't there to help Qui-Gon when he faced Maul alone. He simply couldn't keep up with the other 2.
And Kenobi lost in "direct Saber combat" twice. First time when he was boot kicked and disarmed (with Qui-Gon's help no less) and second time when he fell down the pit.
Both times he was FULLY disarmed, not just "partially" disarmed. And Maul did those both times without any kind of Amp or Rage Enhancement.
And yes Kenobi sliced him in the end by a completely surprise attack. Maul had no idea Kenobi still had a Lightsaber available to him, like Marco has proven.
Nope DP and you know it. These are the facts and they can't be countered in anyway shape or form.
Maul, never not once disarmed Kenobi with his saber. Not one time. We see this happen all the time in saber duel.. ya know.. they out duel somebody with their saber. Obviously sometimes there are kicks and force pushes... but most times it's direct saber on saber combat. In that situation Maul never, not once could get the advantage on Kenobi. On the contrary Kenobi partially disarmed Maul of his weapon with his own saber.
Why are you going on and on about a force push as if it's something special. Maul didn't overpower Kenobi in the saber lock either... He pushed him back and then force pushed him. Is this supposed to be impressive? It isn't the least bit more impressive than Kenobi partially disarming him... nor his it more impressive than Kenobi cutting him in two.
Think about what you're saying... you're saying Maul is superior because he kicked Kenobi while in a saber duel.. and then force pushed him while in a saber duel... Somehow in some weird world that is more impressive than... Kenobi partially disarming Maul of his weapon.. or Kenobi flying through the air.. calling Jin saber.. flipping over him and cutting him in two.. WITH MAUL LOOKING AT HIM THE ENTIRE TIME AND UNABLE TO REACT. To even think a force push or kick is more impressive than being disarmed in a bad position and still killing your foe who sees what you're doing is bordering on stupid. I like you DP, but are you really saying those two things maul did are more impressive?
Originally posted by Marco1907
@PsychotronIf you want another source, since you take only movies (which is fine) here
starwars. com says ''Maul toyed with him'' ;http://www.starwars.com/databank/obi-wan-kenobi
''Maul toyed with him, kicking Obi-Wan’s lightsaber into the abyss, ''
This site only take reference from movies and animations (since only these are canon now except SoD and Tarkin)
As for RotS Obi-Wan (since he was become comparable to Dooku and bested Anakin where Dooku fails) being superior duelist than TPM Darth Maul, I would agree with this. (but not by much) But then, TCW Darth Maul has grown much more powerful in Clone Wars, and he is much better duelist than his TPM version.
How is any of this impressive.. Now it's impressive that Maul toyed with Kenobi... Not toyed mind you when he was getting partially disarmed or cut into a pint sized midget... But it's impressive to toy with somebody hanging down a pit, struggling to hold on.. with no weapon.. and you kick their weapon.. That's impressive ?
Listen, no amount of excuses changes these cold hard facts... MAUL WAS LOOKING DIRECTLY AT KENOBI... SAW him fly through the air... call a weapon to his hand... Flip over him.. and he could do NOTHING about it. To be in that advantageous position and still lose is pretty pathetic. It shows Kenobi's speed.. resourcefulness... and cunning. We can all make excuses for maul and say he was overconfident but that's irrelevant... That's his character, so he would always be and would always be susceptible because of it. So, it's not taken away, in fact, it's applied to every single one of his fights. There is literally no way to get around the fact that Kenobi cut maul in two in a horrible position. no amount of excuses changes this.
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Conjecture isn't proof buddy.
Don't be silly KT. The proof is right there. Kenobi was completely helpless in that picture. Lucky for him he had Qui-Gon saving his ass.
Heck he even defeats Maul in the end with a surprise attack using Qui-Gon's Lightsaber. More undeniable proof Kenobi had Zero chance of winning on his own.
Heck honestly, you could have pitted 2 TPM Kenobi's against Maul, and Maul would have killed them both IMHO.
The only undeniable proof is that Kenobi made maul into a pint sized midget while in a horrible position with Maul looking right at him. Yet he couldn't react fast enough to do a thing about it. That is the only undeniable proof here. Furthermore, Kenobi being in a bad position earlier doesn't mean he lost... He in a terrible position before and still found a way... So please spare me the whole he was done bit... The have undeniable facts that Kenobi can and has overcome situations like that AND it happened to be against this very foe. Kenobi wins.
Tell me KT exactly what was Kenobi going to do from that position in the picture? What? You do realize before Kenobi was able to get back up and pick up his Lightsaber, Qui-Gon punched Maul who fell down 2 stories landing flat on his back, Qui-Gon jumped down after him, Maul kicked him got back up and they started fighting again... You really telling me in all that time, Maul couldn't have just jumped down and stabbed Kenobi?!
That's bullcrap and you know it.
You also Claim Maul simply couldn't react to Kenobi from a better position. So then WHY couldn't Kenobi simply Blitz Maul In that Whole Long Saber fight?
Again you know that's Bull crap.
And Whose the One Who Had Help the Whole Damn fight apart from the very end? Who had the biggest Time-Out from the fighting? Who fought the Longest? Who had to find someone else's weapon to use for a surprise attack?
All the Evidence and all the Proof is against you and Psychotron and you are Literally just grasping for straws here.
Grasping at straws LOL.. That's rich. We're the side who's VICTORIOUS and turn maul into a midget. There is no grasping needed for the winning side. You're the one making excuses for Maul losing and trying to find any which way to make it like Kenobi didn't beat him.. HE DID. Period.
I don't need to theorize what Kenobi could've done in that position.. why would I do that and what would it prove. All I need to do is show Kenobi can and has overcome bad positions before and came out on top. CHECK. Which therefore PROVES that Kneobi wasn't assured death now was he DP? If you claim that it's a 100% fact Kenobi was going to die than we can't discuss things further. That goes against all logic and reason. Sure he wasn't in a good position.. sure he could've been killed... but he could've also found a way like he always does.
Buddy don't make excuses or try and make me prove a negative on why something didn't happen. We saw what DID happen. Kenobi in a terrible position (lower ground.. no weapon) was able to fly in the air... call his sword.. flip over maul and land a killing blow.. all the while Maul saw him do it and couldn't react. THAT IS what happened. NO amount of excuses changes that fact.
Yes and who exactly is the "winning side" here? Was it just Kenobi? No. It was Qui-Gon + Kenobi with a major casualty on the "winning side."
The novel makes it perfectly clear Maul > Qui-Gon > Kenobi. But don't let silly things like proof get in the way of your argument KT.
And LOL at Kenobi getting out of the position in that picture if not for Qui-Gon. Also you're welcome to explain how Kenobi even ended up in such a shitty position when he even had help from a greater Jedi, if he was superior to Maul as you claim LOL.
Lol yeah you're really grasping for straws.
Again the person grasping at straws is the person trying to explain away maul getting sliced into a pint sized midget. Those are the only straws being grasp here. Of course he could get out of the position and that is possible.. No way it isn't as he got out of a bad situation later against the same foe. To even argue otherwise is bordering shortbus material to say that's not possible. Keep making excuses.. Kenobi won