Kurse vs. General Zod

Originally posted by Placidity
A real life peak human can run twice as fast as that.

But his feat may not be as slow as it appears, you need to keep in mind a few things:

- he is working against gravity. You could probably work out how fast he was accounting for this as well.

- He seems to be accelerating, as his final lunge appears to cover a larger distance.

Well, his strength made gravity much less of an issue, I reckon. And the lunge thing is more of a strength factor, as well. All in all, less a speed thing, more of a strength thing IMO.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Actually did the math for that and you're a little off.

Here is the clip:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnAw3E_mLh8

From the ff. timestamps:

(2:02) looks like the building had about 8 segments with each segment containing 5 stories (thus 40 stories) it also looks like Zod cleared 9 stories on his initial leap upwards.

(2:03-2:05) Zod did 4 lunges in this space of time.

(2:08) Looks like Zod is about 4 segments from reaching the top.

Assuming 1 story is 3 meters (floors in this building look rather short IMO).

From this observation alone, one can ascertain:

Tha Zod cleared 11 stories (40 - 9 (cleared by jump) - 20 (position at 2:08) ) within 5 seconds (2:03-2:08) or 11/5 or 2.2 story per second.

2.2 story per second x 3 meters/story = 6.6m/s or 23.76kph or 14.85mph

Bear in mind this was done because he was (from visual observation) clearing about 1 story per lunge, not because he was moving his limbs very fast. From just counting, he did 4 lunges in a little over 2 seconds. Which about correlates with my math above.

Thank you. That was pretty cool. Wow..thats...only 15 mph? I was pretty far off lol And im pretty sure real life humans only run like 115-24 mph. Never heard of a human that can run 30 mph

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Both Qui-Gon and Obi Wan used the same power, at the same time, the same way, the skill does not seem to be unique in style and nature to the specific persons. Qui-Gon taught Obi Wan the same way as Dooku taught Qui Gon and Yoda taught Dooku. It is not unreasonable to assume that the skills were passed down between master and student. Unless you think QG invented force speed. But rules are rules. I think it comes down to if both sides of a debate wants to consider certain exceptions to the rule due to reasonable logic (as above).

However, Faora fought differently from Kal-El (and had an obvious speed difference as Kal) and she's def much faster than Nam Ek. They each fought differently in the movie and Zod had a crap ton of chances to showcase his speed in his fight with Kal And he did (as relentless pointed out, he did a pretty fast bullrush at the start of his fight with Kal El). Just not nearly the same blinding speed as Faora. He rushed pretty fast, tho (based on the video above, about 25 feet within a second, 0:23-0:24 exactly).

I'd say about as fast as a flying Thor or Mjolnir. More or less.

Yeah that argument's fine. I was just arguing against the "can't ever interchange feats" rule, as that clearly would be silly in something like the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan case.

Kind of like if Supergirl moved a Planet then it should go without saying that Superman can move a planet.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah that argument's fine. I was just arguing against the "can't ever interchange feats" rule, as that clearly would be silly in something like the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan case.

Kind of like if Supergirl moved a Planet then it should go without saying that Superman can move a planet.

Those are the rules, tho. And rules are rules. The specific example on the ruling stated (IIRC) if BRB smashes a planet, doesn't mean Thor can.

Not gonna argue on when the rules apply and when it does not, however.

I think certain arguments (like Voldemort being able to do basic spells performed by lower lvl wizards or Yoda being able to do what the student of his student did) are reasonable but, then again, if a mod says no. It's no.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah that argument's fine. I was just arguing against the "can't ever interchange feats" rule, as that clearly would be silly in something like the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan case.

Kind of like if Supergirl moved a Planet then it should go without saying that Superman can move a planet.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah that argument's fine. I was just arguing against the "can't ever interchange feats" rule, as that clearly would be silly in something like the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan case.

Kind of like if Supergirl moved a Planet then it should go without saying that Superman can move a planet.

It's varied in here and during the great original 'Star Wars Vs Harry Potter' thread many years ago Imp ruled that similar powered beings can use each other's powers within reason even if not shown.

eg Darth Maul could use Force-Choke as it's a Sith/Jedi power, even though he didn't explicitly use Force-Choke in TPM.

edit: just ask Imp for a ruling in here if you need, considering Zod has the same powers and he became more powerful/diverse than Faora

That's the thing... Bolt may be the fastest guy on earth... that doesn't mean he's the most agile, best reactions, best acceleration etc etc. Just like all humans are very similar at a biological level. The difference from person to person are very very minimal in the over all scene of physiology. That doesn't mean we all run the same speed, reaction at the same time. You have may a twin brother who's almost exactly like you in every way, that doesn't mean they have the same fighting speed.

You need to practice MOVING that fast and fighting at that speed. You need train your muscles to be able to respond at certain speeds and times. They are built up. Not everybody is born with fast twitch muscles fibers.. some are born with slow twitch. Point is, just because Faora was shown fighting at that speed with that skill level, doesn't mean Zod could. Doesn't work that way. With time and training, sure, but clearly not normally or he would have. He didn't.

Huh. One of the few times I actually agree with Kurupt.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That's the thing... Bolt may be the fastest guy on earth... that doesn't mean he's the most agile, best reactions, best acceleration etc etc. Just like all humans are very similar at a biological level. The difference from person to person are very very minimal in the over all scene of physiology. That doesn't mean we all run the same speed, reaction at the same time. You have may a twin brother who's almost exactly like you in every way, that doesn't mean they have the same fighting speed.

You need to practice MOVING that fast and fighting at that speed. You need train your muscles to be able to respond at certain speeds and times. They are built up. Not everybody is born with fast twitch muscles fibers.. some are born with slow twitch. Point is, just because Faora was shown fighting at that speed with that skill level, doesn't mean Zod could. Doesn't work that way. With time and training, sure, but clearly not normally or he would have. He didn't.

Spot on, and lets be real. Zod showed almost 0 level of actual fighting "skill". Faora was obviously the most battle hardened out of the entire crew. Zod must have been born a 4 star general on Krypton to explain his lack of skill and his inability to keep his emotions in check. He had definitely never been any kind of frontline troop or anything.

Originally posted by Robtard
It's varied in here and during the great original 'Star Wars Vs Harry Potter' thread many years ago Imp ruled that similar powered beings can use each other's powers within reason even if not shown.

eg Darth Maul could use Force-Choke as it's a Sith/Jedi power, even though he didn't explicitly use Force-Choke in TPM.

That makes a lot more sense.

Depends on the scenario IMO.

With something like Force Lightning I'd understand, as that's a unique power which has only been displayed by people of a certain tier. But to say Maul can't use Force Suggestion because we didn't see him do that, knowing it's a basic power for Jedi/Sith, would be silly and a pretty worthless debate IMO.

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
Spot on, and lets be real. Zod showed almost 0 level of actual fighting "skill". Faora was obviously the most battle hardened out of the entire crew. Zod must have been born a 4 star general on Krypton to explain his lack of skill and his inability to keep his emotions in check. He had definitely never been any kind of frontline troop or anything.

Lol. Zod got beat up by everybody that fought him. He was a terrible villain. Kurse would beat him too and I dont think it would even be close.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
That makes a lot more sense.

Depends on the scenario IMO.

With something like Force Lightning I'd understand, as that's a unique power which has only been displayed by people of a certain tier. But to say Maul can't use Force Suggestion because we didn't see him do that, knowing it's a basic power for Jedi/Sith, would be silly and a pretty worthless debate IMO.

Yeah, well I guess if using in character one could say Maul wouldnt use suggestion he would just kill them. But yeah, jedi/Sith/military etc all have "basics" and bootcamps and whatnot that if you dont pass or cant comprehend, ya dont get in correct? So whatever those basic skills that are included in the sith/jedi training courses are should automatically be assumed to be doable by any Sith/Jedi right?

I mean, if someone told you the were a Raider or Seal or SAS or whatever your going to automatically assume they are proficcient with an M16 or AK and are a damn good shot.

And I think arguing in character is stupid because writers never stick to another writers stuff. Look at how everyone in Asgard is acting right now, or Superman makin samiches for his boss. Theyre character always changes writer to writer.

Originally posted by tkitna
Lol. Zod got beat up by everybody that fought him. He was a terrible villain. Kurse would beat him too and I dont think it would even be close.

Robtard loved him as a villain.

😂

Originally posted by FrothByte
Huh. One of the few times I actually agree with Kurupt.

It happens far more than you'd like to admit

Get a room you two

Originally posted by Robtard
Get a room you two

Originally posted by FrothByte
I know Hulk is stronger than Thor. But Thor was able to block Hulk's hammer punch (though with difficulty) and was strong enough to spin Hulk around with a punch. That's still a pretty good strength showing. My point was, he was unable to do any of those stuff with Kurse, which is what makes me rate Kurse stronger than Hulk, which is why I'm unsure who's stronger between Kurse and Zod.

And Thor hits did nothing to the Hulk compared to what Ironman buster and Abomination hits did. Do you admit that both of these people are far stronger than Thor?

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That's the thing... Bolt may be the fastest guy on earth... that doesn't mean he's the most agile, best reactions, best acceleration etc etc. Just like all humans are very similar at a biological level. The difference from person to person are very very minimal in the over all scene of physiology. That doesn't mean we all run the same speed, reaction at the same time. You have may a twin brother who's almost exactly like you in every way, that doesn't mean they have the same fighting speed.

You need to practice MOVING that fast and fighting at that speed. You need train your muscles to be able to respond at certain speeds and times. They are built up. Not everybody is born with fast twitch muscles fibers.. some are born with slow twitch. Point is, just because Faora was shown fighting at that speed with that skill level, doesn't mean Zod could. Doesn't work that way. With time and training, sure, but clearly not normally or he would have. He didn't.

The problem with this is the difference between peak human and average human is actually not that large in the scheme of things.

For example, the fastest sprinter is "only" about 30% quicker than your average healthy man.

When someone like Faora moves at super-speed, she is going many orders of magnitude faster than Zod. If they have similar physiology, even if Faora specifically trained for speed, she still shouldn't be that much faster than a fellow kryptonian. And keep in mind, I really doubt Zod is your average Joe Kryptonian.

While I'm at it, I'd like to point out the false but common idea that super-speed runners aren't necessarily fast fighters as well. One false analogy is Usain Bolt is not necessarily a fast fighter even though he can run fast. As per above, Usain is only 30% faster. When we are talking about a super-speedster we are often talking about someone hundreds of times faster (speed of sound, speed of light etc). Running requires coordinated movement of arms and legs, if the speedster can move at the speed of sound, he sure as hell can "fight" fast, at least compared to anyone that is not close to his running speed.

Yet Zod has zero feats of running or fighting at superspeed.