Originally posted by cs_zoltan
It's not. You are talking shit.Btw, Yoda pushed Dooku's shit in even in Y: DR, where Yoda was weakened and Dooku was amped.
You mean on Vjun where 3 lightsiders; Anakin, Whie and Scout all said how they felt much stronger on the planet and demonstrate greater power then they would otherwise be capable of off planet? Lol.
Originally posted by Syndicate
Given Dooku's own performance against Yoda and the fact that 2 inferior opponents ( Ventress and Savage ) would not be as formidable of a threat as a single superior opponent ( Dooku ) against someone like Sidious or Yoda ( as demonstrated by Maul and Savage in their fight against Sidious ) I'm inclined to disagree.
Also, Mace and Anakin are at least within the same ballpark as Dooku (as per Windu quotes and Anakin flat out matching and beating Dooku), and they couldn't even properly perceive Sidious moving.
He just really isn't on par with Yoda and Sheev in terms of lightsaber combat... or really anything combative.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
But I'm comparing how duelists of Yoda's level handle Maul and Savage to how duelists of Dooku's level handle Savage and Ventress... and it doesn't look pretty on the end of Dooku level duelists.Also, Mace and Anakin are at least within the same ballpark as Dooku (as per Windu quotes and Anakin flat out matching and beating Dooku), and they couldn't even properly perceive Sidious moving.
He just really isn't on par with Yoda and Sheev in terms of lightsaber combat... or really anything combative.
Given Dooku had like 0 expectations in regards to Savage's skill level and then Ventress gives him his memories ( memories of a lifetime of being a trained/highly skilled warrior ) I'm willing to give Dooku the benefit of the doubt in being disarmed by an unexpectedly skilled/powerful blow.
*Shrug* Perhaps Sidious was augmenting his speed to a greater degree in his fight against the B team so that he could overwhelm them quickly and not waste time expending energy in a prolonged fight against them. In regards to Anakin and Dooku it's logical that Dooku wouldn't be moving as fast as in his fight against Yoda as blocking Anakin's blows is what's taking up the majority of his force reserves. This is more a demonstration of Anakin's superior strength. There's plenty of reasons the speed disparity we see onscreen and throughout the novels could have occurred and I can't fault you for having your own interpretation.
I don't believe he's on par but I believe he can hang with them.
Originally posted by Syndicate
Given Dooku had like 0 expectations in regards to Savage's skill level and then Ventress gives him his memories ( memories of a lifetime of being a trained/highly skilled warrior ) I'm willing to give Dooku the benefit of the doubt in being disarmed by an unexpectedly skilled/powerful blow.*Shrug* Perhaps Sidious was augmenting his speed to a greater degree in his fight against the B team so that he could overwhelm them quickly and not waste time expending energy in a prolonged fight against them. In regards to Anakin and Dooku it's logical that Dooku wouldn't be moving as fast as in his fight against Yoda as blocking Anakin's blows is what's taking up the majority of his force reserves. This is more a demonstration of Anakin's superior strength. There's plenty of reasons the speed disparity we see onscreen and throughout the novels could have occurred and I can't fault you for having your own interpretation.
I don't believe he's on par but I believe he can hang with them.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Considering Dooku's duel with Yoda only lasted like 6 seconds longer than Maul's 1v1 bout with Sidious, I'm not convinced that that is enough proof that they have some sort of parity, especially considering the indication in the difference in their dueling feats that duelists of Yoda and Sidious's tier are head and shoulders above duelists of Dooku's tier.
Given a quote outright states Sidious is toying with him I'd have to disagree.
Dooku has out dueled both Sora Bulq and another Jedi simultaneously with seeming ease and Bulq was able to pressure Mace. He's also managed to casually beat duelists like Ventress and Grievous ( though to be fair he had the advantage of training them ).
Given that Yoda wasn't even wielding the Force offensively against Dooku while he has a sizeable edge in Force power, I don't see any reason why I should believe Yoda was going all-out on Dooku, especially when his peers in the Force (Sidious and Talzin) have raped Dooku in the Force every time they wield it against him. Especially since Dooku's perceptions of even Obi-Wan and AOTC Anakin's speed have baffled his perceptions to some extent, I fail to see how he can conceivably match Yoda's speed well enough to have any form of parity with him.
He did a few times (he hurled a lantern back at the Count, who waved it aside), and hurled Lightning back at the Count twice, who deflected it both times.
Also, Dooku near-blitzes Obi-Wan in the AotC junior novel. His lightsaber "seems to be everywhere", although you can argue that it was a separate narrator's perspective.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Given that Yoda wasn't even wielding the Force offensively against Dooku while he has a sizeable edge in Force power, I don't see any reason why I should believe Yoda was going all-out on Dooku, especially when his peers in the Force (Sidious and Talzin) have raped Dooku in the Force every time they wield it against him. Especially since Dooku's perceptions of even Obi-Wan and AOTC Anakin's speed have baffled his perceptions to some extent, I fail to see how he can conceivably match Yoda's speed well enough to have any form of parity with him.
I'd imagine that's because he realized he had a better chance of beating Dooku in lighstaber combat then a battle in the Force.
Sidious and Talzin are more powerful then Yoda and Talzin's attacks were not the standard force push but full on Sith Sorcery that would be more difficult for Dooku to counter. Also you know my stance on Sidious and Dooku. Given he matched him to the point Yoda was incapable of blitzing him or overwhelming him within seconds that's what I have to assume.
Yet this on par with Yoda as a duelist Dooku gets defeated and outsped by DD Vos? Who isn't even fast enough to not be bowled over by Anakin when he has plenty of time for at least something of a reaction?
I'm sorry but given literally every other indication of Dooku's level and Yoda's level, they are not comparable or on par, there is a pretty wide gap between them.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Yet this on par with Yoda as a duelist Dooku gets defeated and outsped by DD Vos? Who isn't even fast enough to not be bowled over by Anakin when he has plenty of time for at least something of a reaction?I'm sorry but given literally every other indication of Dooku's level and Yoda's level, they are not comparable or on par, there is a pretty wide gap between them.
Outsped? Where does it say Vos beat Dooku because he was faster? It says he beat him because he was more aggressive/ferocious. What do you mean? He reacted to Anakin just fine. He just couldn't handle the force of his kinetic strikes generated by his own strength combined with Djem So.
You're free to hold that opinion if you like.