Originally posted by -Pr-Honestly, I don't agree. There is a lot of misinformation out there about MRAs, and they do actively work to spread awareness of men's issues. Hell, it's where I got most of the links I read that led me to the information I now know.
MRAs in the majority, just like the majority of feminists, just want fairness, and for inequality to become equality.
I can't speak internationally but around here there isn't much of a mainstream MRA presence, where as it's easy to determine feminist sub groups due to how large and well known the movement is.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Then we are on the same page. Maybe. Who knows...
Hence, me analogizing said bullshit with humanshit. Because humans are shittier than bulls. And pigs. And cockroaches. And humans.
I might have had a bit too much Scotch to drink.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Honestly, I don't agree. There is a lot of misinformation out there about MRAs, and they do actively work to spread awareness of men's issues. Hell, it's where I got most of the links I read that led me to the information I now know.MRAs in the majority, just like the majority of feminists, just want fairness, and for inequality to become equality.
Because most MRA websites I go to, they do one, 2 or all 3 of these 3 things:
1. Bash feminists.
2. Openly or backhandedly justify rape.
3. Try to make the shittiest arguments possible in favor of the idea that women shouldn't be enrolled in the Army, or be doctors, or scientists/engineers or any of the other traditionally male-dominated fields.
4.(Yeah, I know I said 3, but still) Bash feminists some more.
Originally posted by Lek Kuen
I can't speak internationally but around hear there isn't much of a mainstream MRA presence, where as it's easy to determine feminist sub groups due to how large and well known the movement is.
It's only starting to gain traction now, so i'm honestly not surprised. It'll take time, but I'm hopeful that they'll be able to raise awareness and spur change.
Hell, they already helped Ireland to get a domestic violence shelter for men open, so they can do good work.
Originally posted by Bardock42
But, like, my point is, Rao's story doesn't prove any sort of gender bias. Rather it's a story of a guy who signed a contract, that apparently in retrospect he didn't like the terms of.
Because as far as I can tell, Rao's example is just another tired old example of a woman almost screwing a guy over in divorce settlement, even though she is the one to blame here(she engaged in adultery, not him).
Here is a link citing Teacher/Student case IN FLORIDA for males a female teachers and what was the outcome.
Female cases are only on page 6
Rao provided it. He said they are married in Florida, that's the contract he agreed to. Personally I wish that was made more clear, but well because of traditional bullshit it's obfuscated.
How do we know that she screwed him over? They were married and had children together, so, like I said, obviously his career is not solely based on him, she supported him.
Originally posted by Epicurus
Could you share some of the links that link you to these mythical-sounding MRAs?Because most MRA websites I go to, they do one, 2 or all 3 of these 3 things:
1. Bash feminists.
2. Openly or backhandedly justify rape.
3. Try to make the shittiest arguments possible in favor of the idea that women shouldn't be enrolled in the Army, or be doctors, or scientists/engineers or any of the other traditionally male-dominated fields.
4.(Yeah, I know I said 3, but still) Bash feminists some more.
The main one I view is the section on Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/
There is a fair bit of shite there, but when they do stuff well, they really do it well. if you look in the sidebar, they offer a lot of good information and reading material.
Obviously, not everything can be taken blindly, but there is a lot of really good, well-backed up information available through them.
A Voice for Men is a bit more of a dual personality site:
They can have some amazing, well-written stuff at times, and then there's the women-hating bullshit.
Seriously though, why would anyone hate women? Individual ones can be *****, sure, but on the whole they're awesome in so many ways.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Rao provided it. He said they are married in Florida, that's the contract he agreed to. Personally I wish that was made more clear, but well because of traditional bullshit it's obfuscated.How do we know that she screwed him over? They were married and had children together, so, like I said, obviously his career is not solely based on him, she supported him.
Hey, I am just going off of Rao's account. If you have proof that his citation of said account is suspect, then bring it over for everyone to see.
Otherwise quit using apologist semantics to justify the fact that American divorce laws are horribly biased in favor of women these days.
Originally posted by -Pr-
The main one I view is the section on Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/There is a fair bit of shite there, but when they do stuff well, they really do it well. if you look in the sidebar, they offer a lot of good information and reading material.
Obviously, not everything can be taken blindly, but there is a lot of really good, well-backed up information available through them.
A Voice for Men is a bit more of a dual personality site:
They can have some amazing, well-written stuff at times, and then there's the women-hating bullshit.
Seriously though, why would anyone hate women? Individual ones can be *****, sure, but on the whole they're awesome in so many ways.
Those are the two ones I base my view of MRA on as well, interesting we come to opposite conclusions.
Then there's also the truly crazy ones, like The Red Pill, Return of Kings, Men Going Their Own Way...
Originally posted by Bardock42
Rao provided it. He said they are married in Florida, that's the contract he agreed to. Personally I wish that was made more clear, but well because of traditional bullshit it's obfuscated.How do we know that she screwed him over? They were married and had children together, so, like I said, obviously his career is not solely based on him, she supported him.
I think she is entitled of some of the money they made together, however she is the one who decided to end the agreement by committing adultery and the husband finding out.
Though I disagree on his business being successful because she was helping him by raising the kids and staying at home.
The success of the business depends on how HE or SHE (the owner of the business) manage the business, not to weather the wife or the husband stay at home and take care of the kids, but she is still entitled 1/2 of the money they got as group.
The tricky part is that she got that "lifestyle" crap accepted by the court and he had to pay for it, even though she was the one who decide to risk the marriage by sleeping with the gym trainer, that by the way was also being paid by him.
Originally posted by Epicurus
Otherwise quit using apologist semantics to justify the fact that American divorce laws are horribly biased in favor of women these days.
But they aren't really. They just account for the fact that men generally take the role of bread winner, while women do domestic duties, in order to come to an equitable separation. Not accounting for that unjustly favour the revenue generating part of a family.
Originally posted by Bardock42
They just really aren't. They just account for the fact that men generally take the role of bread winner, while women do domestic duties, in order to come to an equitable separation. Not accounting for that unjustly favour the revenue generating part of a family.
That may have been the case in the 60s, or even in the 80s.
This is 2014. And women, at least in the West, have almost closed the gap in the employment rate with men, with females surpassing males in some areas/regions. You could make the unequal wages argument, but that is a separate issue and has a host of factors which contribute to it.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Those are the two ones I base my view of MRA on as well, interesting we come to opposite conclusions.Then there's also the truly crazy ones, like The Red Pill, Return of Kings, Men Going Their Own Way...
Red Pill are *****. They don't give a **** about helping men gain equality in the areas where they're at a disadvantage. They shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as MRAs, imo.
MGTOW is still not really what I would call a branch of MRA either, but that's imo.
A lot of the men on reddit are deeply cynical because they've lost their kids or been through messy divorces, so there is some wiggle room where you have to take things with a pinch of salt.
the MRA section on reddit does provide a lot of good information though, if you take the time to read through it.
Originally posted by Lek Kuen
What kills me is the people who hate women are often same ones who don't get why they have trouble getting women
Aye. I mean sure, there are bad women, but there are bad men too.
Originally posted by Epicurus
😂That may have been the case in the 60s, or even in the 80s.
This is 2014. And women, at least in the West, have almost closed the gap in the employment rate with men, with females surpassing males in some areas/regions. You could make the unequal wages argument, but that is a separate issue and has a host of factors which contribute to it.
Rao's example is one of traditional gender roles. If he can show one where the man and woman worked equally as much to contribute to the family and yet the man was still the one having to pay upon separation then he should post that. Since he didn't, it's not relevant.
Originally posted by Epicurus
What contract? That she gets to screw him over to the point where he has to rely on expensive lawyers to save his ass, while she doesn't get to spend a single goddamned dime?Hey, I am just going off of Rao's account. If you have proof that his citation of said account is suspect, then bring it over for everyone to see.
Otherwise quit using apologist semantics to justify the fact that American divorce laws are horribly biased in favor of women these days.
Yes, divorce law is biased towards women at least in Florida.
I do not know if this is a common trend (or I just notice it), but there are divorce specialist for men now, there are not too many, but there are some.