Sauron vs. Night King

Originally posted by quanchi112
Night King hasn't shown enough to say he can best Sauron IMO. Sauron's abilities, power, and magic seem too much for the Night King. Let's face it save the dragons the most of the regular soldiers are inferior to the regular soldiers of Lotr.

Even your super strong Mountain would be utterly raped by Bolg to the point it wouldn't be close by any stretch of the imagination. And yet he's a big deal in GoT.

No. As i said No Evidence to prove that S can kill NK/ nor that he can't.

He is because of his ability to raise the dead. Since this 1 vs 1. He loses a huge ability. Or his most formidable ability i would say.

I believe he would also be a BIG thing in LoTR.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Night King hasn't shown enough to say he can best Sauron IMO. Sauron's abilities, power, and magic seem too much for the Night King. Let's face it save the dragons the most of the regular soldiers are inferior to the regular soldiers of Lotr.

Even your super strong Mountain would be utterly raped by Bolg to the point it wouldn't be close by any stretch of the imagination. And yet he's a big deal in GoT.

Do you have a map of the place where the Battle of the 5 armies took place. We might be able to work with that.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
No. As i said No Evidence to prove that S can kill NK/ nor that he can't.

He is because of his ability to raise the dead. Since this 1 vs 1. He loses a huge ability. Or his most formidable ability i would say.

I believe he would also be a BIG thing in LoTR.

Even in army type matches Sauron's entire forces would decimate the NK's armies.

Nah, he'd be some lower level bad guy.

Hmm, it might surprise people that I actually like Game of thrones/A song of Ice and Fire more than I liked the Hobbit and Lord of the Rings. I find Martin's storytelling more compelling and more thoughtful. Tolkien charted out his universe well, and he fleshed out the setting, but other than Bilbo and the Hobbits, his characterization was not as advanced as martins characters, who have a lot more depth and shades of gray to them.

That said, it has no bearing on vs matches, where we try to be as objective, and evidence backed as we can be. Just because I love a franchise more, does not mean I'm going to irrevocably back it. I for example love Transformers G1, (Especially since I'm an 80s kid 😛 ), but I know i can say that they lose to other franchises when warranted.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Youve seen the gif of him swinging his mace. There's nothing to support NK surviving any of that.

Even in army type matches Sauron's entire forces would decimate the NK's armies.

Nah, he'd be some lower level bad guy.

Nothing to support it will....see my point.

Lets leave that for the GoT vs LoTR thread. When you making it?

Get a map so i can approve it for the other thread Quanchi.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Youve seen the gif of him swinging his mace. There's nothing to support NK surviving any of that.

Even in army type matches Sauron's entire forces would decimate the NK's armies.

Nah, he'd be some lower level bad guy.

Eh... I'd put him about on par with the Nazgul at least. Well... If my assumption that he's at least as good combatwise as Aragorn or Boromir.

Right now, he'd be a kind of nameless evil, a necromancer who sends out armies of undead and frost demons down from the Iron Mountains, perhaps a last gasp of the evils of Utumno and Angbad. (Morgoth and Sauron's fortresses in prior ages. Angbad, Sauron's fortress under the Thrangorodrim was where Ancalagon the Black was born 😛 )

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Nothing to support it will....see my point.

Lets leave that for the GoT vs LoTR thread. When you making it?

Get a map so i can approve it for the other thread Quanchi.

Well respond in that thread and tell me if you accept the map. Then post your final numbers we agreed to. I'll do the same and I'll make the thread tomorrow.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Hmm, it might surprise people that I actually like Game of thrones/A song of Ice and Fire more than I liked the Hobbit and Lord of the Rings. I find Martin's storytelling more compelling and more thoughtful. Tolkien charted out his universe well, and he fleshed out the setting, but other than Bilbo and the Hobbits, his characterization was not as advanced as martins characters, who have a lot more depth and shades of gray to them.

That said, it has no bearing on vs matches, where we try to be as objective, and evidence backed as we can be. Just because I love a franchise more, does not mean I'm going to irrevocably back it. I for example love Transformers G1, (Especially since I'm an 80s kid 😛 ), but I know i can say that they lose to other franchises when warranted.

I agree completly. I believe they are different concepts.

Where Martin focuses on a more realistic perspective, Tolkien does a more legendary/mythological one.

I like GOT because it has EVERYTHING. IT has politics, romance, betrayal, suspense. The full package.

When you see game of thrones it opens your mind. Cause it is more realistic. Imagine all those stories of Giants, and Minotaurs, and Centaurs, and Mermaids....What if they were real? Just like White Walkers were stories for Westeros...It is more realistic.

If we compare Sauron with the Night King...they are different types of Villains.

Sauron is the more mighty, undestructible, fearsome type.
NK is the mysterious, cunning, unpredictable, fearless villain.

When you watch Sauron you think, "Wow so powerful! What spell was that!!?"

When you watch NK you think,"What is he gonna do now!? Oh! Are Those Giants he just awoke!!!!?"

I think NK is a more complex villain than Sauron. Sauron on the other hand is the more mythological powerful/mighty villain.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Eh... I'd put him about on par with the Nazgul at least. Well... If my assumption that he's at least as good combatwise as Aragorn or Boromir.

Right now, he'd be a kind of nameless evil, a necromancer who sends out armies of undead and frost demons down from the Iron Mountains, perhaps a last gasp of the evils of Utumno and Angbad. (Morgoth and Sauron's fortresses in prior ages. Angbad, Sauron's fortress under the Thrangorodrim was where Ancalagon the Black was born 😛 )

Ancalagon the black wasn't a dragon of Sauron.

Naah The NK would be a contender to Sauron. He could raise dead Orcs and allt he other species. Trolls and stuff. He would be basically a version of NK of LoTR! hahahaha.

Lotr is like Dragon Age while GoT is like the Witcher. No surprise I love dragon age and Lotr over the others. I enjoy them all but Dragon Age and Lotr are more of what I prefer.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Nothing to suggest he can withstand that power. It's like saying Sauron can't kill a modern day human being because we haven't seen it and don't know for sure.

Well respond in that thread and tell me if you accept the map. Then post your final numbers we agreed to. I'll do the same and I'll make the thread tomorrow.

But NK no ordinary man.

Tomorrow i shall do that. I gtg now. We continue the other thread tomorrow. And can begin talking about numbers for the new thread.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Ancalagon the black wasn't a dragon of Sauron.

Naah The NK would be a contender to Sauron. He could raise dead Orcs and allt he other species. Trolls and stuff. He would be basically a version of NK of LoTR! hahahaha.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Lotr is like Dragon Age while GoT is like the Witcher. No surprise I love dragon age and Lotr over the others. I enjoy them all but Dragon Age and Lotr are more of what I prefer.

I don't like it cause it got no Dragons.

LoTR got no dragons remember that? They were all dead by then....

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
But NK no ordinary man.

Tomorrow i shall do that. I gtg now. We continue the other thread tomorrow. And can begin talking about numbers for the new thread.

Post the numbers in this thread tonight before you go to bed.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
I agree completly. I believe they are different concepts.

Where Martin focuses on a more realistic perspective, Tolkien does a more legendary/mythological one.

I like GOT because it has EVERYTHING. IT has politics, romance, betrayal, suspense. The full package.

When you see game of thrones it opens your mind. Cause it is more realistic. Imagine all those stories of Giants, and Minotaurs, and Centaurs, and Mermaids....What if they were real? Just like White Walkers were stories for Westeros...It is more realistic.

If we compare Sauron with the Night King...they are different types of Villains.

Sauron is the more mighty, undestructible, fearsome type.
NK is the mysterious, cunning, unpredictable, fearless villain.

When you watch Sauron you think, "Wow so powerful! What spell was that!!?"

When you watch NK you think,"What is he gonna do now!? Oh! Are Those Giants he just awoke!!!!?"

I think NK is a more complex villain than Sauron. Sauron on the other hand is the more mythological powerful/mighty villain.

Agreed. it's a different method of storytelling, and different characters. Right now, we still don't know why the Night king is doing what he does. What drives him, motivates him. Does he even have a motive anymore, or is he driven completely by the implanted Dragonglass shard in his chest? Nobody knows.

We sort of know what Sauron's motivations are, mostly through the Simarilion, as he is just as vague in the movies as any dark overlord style villain, and we never really get a personal point of view of Sauron or really any of his servants. Saruman is the closes we get to a personal overvillain there, and his motivations were corrupted by Sauron long ago.

We need to wait really to get a better perspective of the Night King's combat capabilities. Jon vs NK will be good to see... hopefully better than most of the fights we've gotten thus far. the last really good fight was Oberyn vs Gregor. And before that it was Bronn vs Vardis.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Agreed. it's a different method of storytelling, and different characters. Right now, we still don't know why the Night king is doing what he does. What drives him, motivates him. Does he even have a motive anymore, or is he driven completely by the implanted Dragonglass shard in his chest? Nobody knows.

We sort of know what Sauron's motivations are, mostly through the Simarilion, as he is just as vague in the movies as any dark overlord style villain, and we never really get a personal point of view of Sauron or really any of his servants. Saruman is the closes we get to a personal overvillain there, and his motivations were corrupted by Sauron long ago.

We need to wait really to get a better perspective of the Night King's combat capabilities. Jon vs NK will be good to see... hopefully better than most of the fights we've gotten thus far. the last really good fight was Oberyn vs Gregor. And before that it was Bronn vs Vardis.

It is also good to remember that the NK doesn't even exist in the books.
The NK is an HBO invention.

Also WW aren't humans transformed by COTF. In the Books they are just another humanoid specie.

So....the Stories are different in that perspective. One has a Main Villain. The other has a General enemy (Villain would be irrational cause the WW aren't necessary evil)

Originally posted by quanchi112
I know but you have my point. If you can't show me him surviving anything comparable to Sauron's power it is reasonable to say he dies.

Post the numbers in this thread tonight before you go to bed.

In this thread or in the other?

All numbers are the same except for the Number of Giants which is now 15.
Also we have 10 bears now.

I gave you the numbers already. Just read the other Thread.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
In this thread or in the other?

All numbers are the same except for the Number of Giants which is now 15.
Also we have 10 bears now.

I gave you the numbers already. Just read the other Thread.

65k Shields
10k Dothraki
500 boats.....that reply.

That is the latest update prior to the change of the Giants and the Addition of the Bears.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
In this thread or in the other?

All numbers are the same except for the Number of Giants which is now 15.
Also we have 10 bears now.

I gave you the numbers already. Just read the other Thread.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Just post the updated numbers with the 15 Giants and 10 bears now so I can look at them.

kk