I don’t think it’s as much of a mismatch as others might claim. Aquaman has some good feats and stuff that could do well putting him up against Orion.
Like the fact he took a prolonged blast from Starro that oneshotted Orion.
He’s routinely matches Wonder Woman whose outperformed Orion in her solo title.
His trident can absorb and redirect energy powerful enough to eviscerate Etrigan the Demon so I’d argue it should be able to do the same against the Astro force.
In pure physicals I’d imagine Orion to be greater. But Aquaman definitely has win scenarios with the trident and TP.
I don’t think it’s as much of a mismatch as others might claim. Aquaman has some good feats and stuff that could do well putting him up against Orion.Like the fact he took a prolonged blast from Starro that oneshotted Orion.
He’s routinely matches Wonder Woman whose outperformed Orion in her solo title.
His trident can absorb and redirect energy powerful enough to eviscerate Etrigan the Demon so I’d argue it should be able to do the same against the Astro force.
In pure physicals I’d imagine Orion to be greater. But Aquaman definitely has win scenarios with the trident and TP.
Wonder woman performing at Orion level is a serious outlier, and any version of Diana that Arthur has done well against isn't on that level.
TP isn't doing Jack to Orion without first taking out the mother box that protects him from mental attacks. Taking out said MB makes Orion dog of war mode and then Arthur is utterly screwed
The physical differences are massive Orion is only a step off Superman physically, Diana is a tier or two at leas below, Arthur might be able to give her a decent fight but he is also a tier below her. Orion only needs one good hit to end it.
To simplify
A super welterweight (Aquaman) can give a decent fight to a super middle Weight (WW) who might from time to time stand up to a heavyweight for a while. Said Supersiper welterweight isn't doing shit to the heavy weight.
Oh a point I left out
In character Orion is a purely physical fighter. He's like Thor who wants to prove himself as a Warrior and doesn't often use his energy powers. The only time he does is when he faces someone who is physically above him. Arthur isn’t so the astro force isn't going to bebused for Arthur to redirect with the trident
Originally posted by EcstaticGrace
I don’t think it’s as much of a mismatch as others might claim. Aquaman has some good feats and stuff that could do well putting him up against Orion.Like the fact he took a prolonged blast from Starro that oneshotted Orion.
He’s routinely matches Wonder Woman whose outperformed Orion in her solo title.
His trident can absorb and redirect energy powerful enough to eviscerate Etrigan the Demon so I’d argue it should be able to do the same against the Astro force.
In pure physicals I’d imagine Orion to be greater. But Aquaman definitely has win scenarios with the trident and TP.
The example with Starro either is a low showing for Orion(or high showing for Aquaman) or Aquaman didn't actually get hit to the same degree. Orion really is on a higher level physically, at least that era for Aquaman.
As pointed out telepathy isn't as effective as you think against him. New Gods are naturally resistant. It took a combined effort for all of Mars' Manhunters(maybe more than just Manhunters) to get illusions working and Apokolipsians fleeing and those were the grunts. Even random No-Name officers were unaffected. Kanto I think it was couldn't even have his mind read. Ect.
Originally posted by beatboks
Wonder woman performing at Orion level is a serious outlier, and any version of Diana that Arthur has done well against isn't on that level.TP isn't doing Jack to Orion without first taking out the mother box that protects him from mental attacks. Taking out said MB makes Orion dog of war mode and then Arthur is utterly screwed
The physical differences are massive Orion is only a step off Superman physically, Diana is a tier or two at leas below, Arthur might be able to give her a decent fight but he is also a tier below her. Orion only needs one good hit to end it.
To simplify
A super welterweight (Aquaman) can give a decent fight to a super middle Weight (WW) who might from time to time stand up to a heavyweight for a while. Said Supersiper welterweight isn't doing shit to the heavy weight.
Eh I definitely disagree with the lot of this. I don’t know much about Orion’s tp defense, but if you have scans that would be awesome.
I don’t think Orion is above Superman physically I think their on par honestly. I also definitely disagree with Arthur being a tier below Diana there on the same tier. And completely disagree with Orion ending a fight between him in Aquaman in just one hit. I think Orion’s the more powerful between the two but I definitely don’t agree with Aquaman not being able to take punishment from Orion
Every fight Flashpoint onwards we’ve seen between Arthur and Diana they’ve been presented as peers I don’t generally agree with strictly going off handbooks or statements but I’d argue the handbooks/statements in this case only solidifies what we’ve seen presented in comics.
Geoff Johns in Forever Evil had Aquaman listed as one of the strongest people on the planet
https://m.imgur.com/PmaR71A
Which isn’t surprising given he’s also the same writer who had Aquaman and Wonder Woman on par during Flashpoint and the same writer going back a continuity to Post-Crisis and had Aquaman beat around Despero after he had beaten up Martian Manhunter
The fight ended the way J’onn surmised it would with Despero having to resort to TP because Despero couldn’t subdue Aquaman physically.
Jeff Parker has Aquaman break out of Diana’s hold/strength and judo flip her. Showing they were on par
Scott Snyder had Wonder Woman thinking she was fighting Cheetah and Aquaman had no issue keeping up with her
https://m.imgur.com/gallery/MW9HJHq
Robert Vendetti has both of them enraged by the Spectre and they seem more or less physically on par with Diana being more skilled in the instance
https://m.imgur.com/gallery/HKsutW9
Based off the DC Rebirth Guidebook too. It states Aquaman and Wonder Woman as equals on land.
That sounds worse to if he even decided to use the Astro Force. Arthur wouldn’t underestimate Orion and we’ve seen the fact that Aquaman’s go to when fighting characters more powerful than him is his trident
Shaggyman
https://i.imgur.com/btMk2fV_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium
Rao
The only difference is Rao was connected to the life force of the people on Earth so he couldn’t be physically put down and Shaggyman has a insane regeneration/healing factor.
I don’t see Aquaman doing fisticuffs with Orion when he has access to his trident.
Originally posted by Delta1938
The example with Starro either is a low showing for Orion(or high showing for Aquaman) or Aquaman didn't actually get hit to the same degree. Orion really is on a higher level physically, at least that era for Aquaman.As pointed out telepathy isn't as effective as you think against him. New Gods are naturally resistant. It took a combined effort for all of Mars' Manhunters(maybe more than just Manhunters) to get illusions working and Apokolipsians fleeing and those were the grunts. Even random No-Name officers were unaffected. Kanto I think it was couldn't even have his mind read. Ect.
To sum up what your saying is “The feat either didn’t happen the same way because Orion is the physically more impressive character, (Despite seeing Aquaman hovering over Starro’s eye and being pulled out of the blast by Zauriel.) and even if the feat is legit we can’t use it because it doesn’t make sense based off their power levels.”
There’s other feats Aquaman has at that time period that were pretty up there. He took a beating from a guy who oneshotted Superman and indirectly broke Hal’s arm. He was basically stalemating Guy Gardner Warrior who Superman has stated before to hit as hard as Doomsday, he beat around Despero and also twoshotted Olympian who twoshotted Martian Manhunter.
What feats of TP do the Mars’ Manhunters have? Martian Manhunter has also struggled to probe Atlantean grunts with a mentality that was suggested to be the pre-evolution of Aquaman’s tp.
I'm not going to get too in to it, just gonna mention this:
Aquaman has been portrayed as a physical peer (strength and durability wise) of the likes of Diana and J'onn for years now. The last decade or so is just the most consistent it's been.
Orion is still superior imo, as I would consider him the closest physical peer to Superman among his fellow heroes.
The only question is whether Arthur's other abilities can help him out. I'm sure he has another wanky trident that does all sorts of weird shit nowadays. Not sure that would counter the astro-force though.
Originally posted by -Pr-
I'm not going to get too in to it, just gonna mention this:Aquaman has been portrayed as a physical peer (strength and durability wise) of the likes of Diana and J'onn for years now. The last decade or so is just the most consistent it's been.
Orion is still superior imo, as I would consider him the closest physical peer to Superman among his fellow heroes.
The only question is whether Arthur's other abilities can help him out. I'm sure he has another wanky trident that does all sorts of weird shit nowadays. Not sure that would counter the astro-force though.
I definitely agree with this. I’m not arguing he’s physically on par with Orion but I don’t see Orion physically oneshotting him either, and if Orion did that would be a good feat for Orion and a poor one for Aquaman.
Dan Abnett did give Aquaman a possible unintentional feat I could get into by scaling.. I’d have to find the scans. Honestly if TP doesn’t work I’d argue Aquaman has a chance to get some wins with his trident. Not every fight has to be a fisticuff.
