Order these guys by speed

One more thing (please read my rebuttal on the prior page to your scans), if you had a truly legitimate scan of Batman actually moving 1/100 or more the distance that an object or beam (that moves at the speed of light) moves in the same time frame then we can either conclude

1) The beam or object was moving slower than the speed of light
Or
2) Batman moved 1/100 or more of the speed of light and therefore he has superhuman level speed (regardless if it was obtained from skill)
Or
3) PIS and it doesn't count towards anything.

h1 arguing with himself

Originally posted by h1a8

That scan is inconclusive. Eyes could have been glowing prior and Batman moved out the way before the fire. The fact that Hello was said supports that.

Originally posted by h1a8

If Darkseid looks at her with his eyes glowing (no pupil to know exactly where he is aiming at) and she holds her bracelet up for defense (before DS fires) then do you think DS would still shoot at her bracelets on purpose? WW doesn't know the exact moment DS is going to fire his OB. It can be in 2 seconds, 5 seconds, or even 10 seconds. She isn't going to just stand there with her bracelets up hoping for the best. WW has no move her bracelets AFTER the beam enters the air, otherwise DS would aim for something else instead of her bracelets.

Originally posted by h1a8
One more thing (please read my rebuttal on the prior page to your scans), if you had a truly legitimate scan of Batman actually moving 1/100 or more the distance that an object or beam (that moves at the speed of light) moves in the same time frame then we can either conclude

1) The beam or object was moving slower than the speed of light
Or
2) Batman moved 1/100 or more of the speed of light and therefore he has superhuman level speed (regardless if it was obtained from skill)
Or
3) PIS and it doesn't count towards anything.

Guess you didn't actually read my posts. I have already addressed them.

So thanks for playing, and you can continue arguing with yourself lol.

Originally posted by Smurph
h1 arguing with himself

Pretty much. He just possesses this arrogance that he is right, when everytime we cross paths I humiliate him.

I mean, he even acknowledges that PIS shouldn't exist:

Originally posted by h1a8
If I was in a comic book then what I said would still be true. Therefore, me being in a comic doesn't disprove what I said.

Yet, when Batman (a human) and IW (a human) possess such attributes, he ignores it, and tries to handwave it away as PIS, which I address.

lol yes.

the same scenario (eyes glowing / laser fired / laser misses) both proves that Batman dodges with skill and no super speed and that Wonder Woman blocks attacks using super speed and no skill.

Originally posted by Smurph
lol yes.

the same scenario (eyes glowing / laser fired / laser misses) both proves that Batman dodges with skill and no super speed and that Wonder Woman blocks attacks using super speed and no skill.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand my point.
WW did not know where DS was aiming (he has no pupils) to be able to block head on and delect the blast at exactly the right angle.
WW didn't know exactly when DS would fire. If she upped her bracelets a second to early then DS aims elsewhere and a second too late then she will be struck. Therefore WW used perception and speed to block.

Batman got a warning. Hello was said while eye's were glowing. Batman got out of the way. It's inconclusive.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Guess you didn't actually read my posts. I have already addressed them.

So thanks for playing, and you can continue arguing with yourself lol.

Pretty much. He just possesses this arrogance that he is right, when everytime we cross paths I humiliate him.

I mean, he even acknowledges that PIS shouldn't exist:

Yet, when Batman (a human) and IW (a human) possess such attributes, he ignores it, and tries to handwave it away as PIS, which I address.

If through skill I can move my arms at a higher velocity than someone else then I'm faster. If through skill I can perceive motion quicker than someone else then I'm faster. The source of my speed is irrelevant as this is about whose faster.

Speed is all about movement speed or reflexes (time it takes to initiate an action AFTER stimuli comes into existence)..

You showed IW bubbling some random blasts with unknown velocity (which doesn't require skill but super powers).

You showed that Batman got out of the way of HV after he had warning and not necessarily after the fire.

Therefore you haven't proven your case sir.

Originally posted by h1a8
You made up a stupid nonsensical theory that is unsupported.
Skill can give a character more speed by making them perceive and move faster. But now they are faster.
You haven't disproved that.

If through skill I can move my arms at a higher velocity than someone else then I'm faster. If through skill I can perceive motion quicker and someone else then I'm faster. The source of my speed is irrelevant.

Speed is all about movement speed or reflexes (time it takes to initiate an action AFTER stimuli comes into existence)..

You showed IW bubbling some random blasts with unknown velocity (which doesn't require skill but super powers).

You showed that Batman got out of the way of HV after he had warning and not necessarily after the fire.

Therefore you haven't proven your case sir.

You didn't see all my scans. Come back when you have. And please don't ignore them 🙂

Edit: no point attempting to debate with you when you are coming from a position of ignorance.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
You didn't see all my scans. Come back when you have. And please don't ignore them 🙂

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I mean, we are just going down a pedantic route now (in front of vs behind).

Batman clearly moves AFTER the HV has fired here:

.

Now, PIS? Sure. But writers don't have 'PIS' - in fact, they'd be offended we use that term ,lol. Batman has no superspeed, but he does have insane skills.

Skills which enable him to react to HV AFTER it was fired. Comics have shown this.

So back to the point in hand. In comics, writers use 'skill' as a catch-all magical BS, which enables a character to cross gaps in physical stats, including speed. Thus, in a discussion about speed, we need to take that into account, and 'deduct points', as it were.

Batman moving out of the way of HV AFTER they have been fired.

The point was to do with energy blasts, no? I have shown energy blasts, right?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Batman moving out of the way of HV AFTER they have been fired.

The point was to do with energy blasts, no? I have shown energy blasts, right?

So that scan isn't from behind. I knew of that feat and that's why I addressed it BEFORE you posted the scan. I knew you were about to post that scan so I countered before you did. It seems you are the one ignoring things.

I'll repeat from that earlier post

So either
1) HV is moving far less than the speed of light
Or
2) Batman can actually move at least 1/100 of the speed of light, regardless if you claim that skill is the source of his speed.
Or
3) It's PIS and not usable. You know that PIS CAN NOT be used as evidence for anything other than to prove PIS.

If through skill I can run a million miles per hour then I can still run a million miles per hour.

The source of my speed is irrelevant to the fact that I can run a million miles per hour. Common sense.

Originally posted by h1a8
So that scan isn't from behind. I knew of that feat and that's why I addressed it BEFORE you posted the scan. I knew you were about to post that scan so I countered before you did. It seems you are the one ignoring things.

I'll repeat from that earlier post

So either
1) HV is moving far less than the speed of light
Or
2) Batman can actually move at least 1/100 of the speed of light, regardless if you claim that skill is the source of his speed.
Or
3) It's PIS and not usable. You know that PIS CAN NOT be used as evidence for anything other than to prove PIS.

PIS does not exist in universe; note my words in my post. The writer does not have PIS - he/she wrote that scene, and the explanation is that Batman has the skills to do what he does.

The alternative is that he has the speed to do what he does, which no writer has ever said. So this can be thrown out.

The third explanation is PIS, as you say. But that is a term we have invented, to explain inexplicable showings. The writer doesn't have the intent that Batman can utilize PIS.

Moreover, you also failed to address my other IW scan. Did we not talk about blasts? And did I not show this? So how am I suddenly ignoring this? You seem to love moving the goal posts - first I had to show blasts, then I now have to quantify exactly said energy blasts?

Why don't YOU quantify Darkseid's energy blasts? After all, Batman (again!) has been able to even say a word as the blasts zipped their way to him.

Originally posted by h1a8
If through skill I can run a million miles per hour then I can still run a million miles per hour.

The source of my speed is irrelevant to the fact that I can run a million miles per hour. Common sense.

Because in comics, skill and speed are two separate concepts. As seen with Batman, and other humans.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
And:

Note she has to not only block, but each shield has a different frequency. Note too, some firing behind her 🙂

H1, did you not ask for blasts? Here you are. Mysteriously, no rebuttal.

Of course, if you want to put the burden of proof on me for these blasts' speed, surely you know how fast Darkseid's blasts are right? Not estimates, a concrete number?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Because in comics, skill and speed are two separate concepts. As seen with Batman, and other humans.

Skill can fuel speed and therefore it is relevant to speed.
If skill makes me run a million miles per then guess what? I can run a million miles per hour.

If skill allows me to move with 1/100 the speed of light then Guess what? I can move at 1/100 the speed of light.

You still have to be fast enough to move out of the way AFTER the fire.

You are just repeating the same unsupported nonsensical argument.

Originally posted by h1a8
Skill can fuel speed and therefore it is relevant to speed.
If skill makes me run a million miles per then guess what? I can run a million miles per hour.

If skill allows me to move with 1/100 the speed of light then Guess what? I can move at 1/100 the speed of light.

You still have to be fast enough to move out of the way AFTER the fire.

You are just repeating the same unsupported nonsensical argument.

Skill is what writers use to explain Batman's showings. They don't rely on PIS as an explanation. Thus, as per writer intent, skill enables humans to have superhuman speed (like with Batman).

Of course, am ignoring goofy comics where PIS is explicitly used (Toon force). Batman doesn't have this, a writer does not sit down and go well ok, he does this because of my own stupidity in writing.

Originally posted by h1a8
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand my point.
WW did not know where DS was aiming (he has no pupils) to be able to block head on and delect the blast at exactly the right angle.
WW didn't know exactly when DS would fire. If she upped her bracelets a second to early then DS aims elsewhere and a second too late then she will be struck. Therefore WW used perception and speed to block.

Batman got a warning. Hello was said while eye's were glowing. Batman got out of the way. It's inconclusive.

All comic book superheroes are able to anticipate attacks with ridiculously unrealistic accuracy. Some are better at this than others. All comic book martial arts experts are exceptionally capable of anticipating attacks. It’s just a fact of the medium.

And FYI, the “hello?” wasn’t a warning from the attacker. Batman abruptly cut off mid-conversation with Gordon and Gordon was saying “hello?” because Batman stopped talking. As usual, you’re overconfident about the interpretation of something that you haven’t bothered to read.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
H1, did you not ask for blasts? Here you are. Mysteriously, no rebuttal.

Of course, if you want to put the burden of proof on me for these blasts' speed, surely you [b]know how fast Darkseid's blasts are right? Not estimates, a concrete number? [/B]

I can sit here an argue the following:

Again the speed is unknown. But even assuming light speed then it's still inconclusive (create bubbles in advanced and aim dodging possibly)

But I won't since my statement still stands

So assuming no prep bubbles or aim dodging then

Either
1) Beams were significantly less than the speed of light
Or
2) Beams where the speed of light and IW moved with at least 1/100 the speed of light.
Or
3)
PIS

Originally posted by Smurph
Your point would be more convincing if you could admit the weaknesses in your argument. Instead, you scramble to make every scan fit into a weirdly inflexible take on how comic book characters operate.

All comic book superheroes are able to anticipate attacks with ridiculously unrealistic accuracy. Some are better at this than others. All comic book martial arts experts are exceptionally capable of anticipating attacks. It’s just a fact of the medium.

And FYI, the “hello?” wasn’t a warning from the attacker. Batman abruptly cut off mid-conversation with Gordon and Gordon was saying “hello?” because Batman stopped talking. As usual, you’re overconfident about the interpretation of something that you haven’t bothered to read.

Anticipating attacks is different than moving in relation to an attack.
If a character moves AFTER the attack launches then speed is needed to be successful.

Sure if you move or block right BEFORE the attack is launched then that's not speed (more so aim dodging or aim blocking). I agree. Buts that not what we are arguing. DS posted a scan with Batman moving AFTER the beam is halfway to him. There's no anticipation in that.

Either the HV isn't very fast
Or
Batman is very fast
Or
It's PIS

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Skill is what writers use to explain Batman's showings. They don't rely on PIS as an explanation. Thus, as per writer intent, skill enables humans to have superhuman speed (like with Batman).

Of course, am ignoring goofy comics where PIS is explicitly used (Toon force). Batman doesn't have this, a writer does not sit down and go well ok, he does this because of my own stupidity in writing.

Again if skill allows me to run a million miles per hour than I can run a million miles per hour.

If skill allows Batman to move at 1/100 the speed of light Or better then Batman can move at 1/100 the speed of light Or better.

The source of speed is irrelevant. It's all about how how you can move or respond.

Here's a joke:

I and Usian Bolt (at his best) race the 100m dash.
I beat him by 4 seconds.
People ask me how I did it.
I tell them I used skill.

Judges disqualify me telling me that skill is illegal.
I cry.