Originally posted by Galan007"WWH" literally started going 'World-Breaker-Mode' in World War Hulk #5.
👆 Where forum lingo/importance is concerned...
"WWH": That's his base level, and encompasses everything Hulk did up to the conclusion of his fight with Sentry. 'World-Breaker-Mode' would not be accessible to this version.
"WBH": His base is essentially HotM-level. Simple.
"Green Scar": A broad term which basically covers that entire era of Hulk's history. He starts off at WWH-ish levels, but also has the potential to go 'World-Breaker' during the battle itself(assuming he gets the right kind of mental 'nudge', obvs.)That's my opinion, at least. /shrug
And that "level" was only further clarified in HotM.
So continuing to separate WBH as if it had nothing to do with WWH is pure artifice borne out of convenience because certain posters don't like the implications and the forum mods don't want to deal with it.
Which is fine.
Because referring to 'Green Scar' is both truer to the comics and eliminates all semantics.
If anybody wants to discuss this, by all means. Otherwise, we're rehashing the explosive butthurt debate in the wake of HotM over nothing. In which case:
Originally posted by ODGI’m pretty sure it had more to do with the passage of time. People were using WWH in threads, then later on started using WBH after that story was released.
"WWH" literally started going 'World-Breaker-Mode' in World War Hulk #5.And that "level" was only further clarified in HotM.
So continuing to separate WBH as if it had nothing to do with WWH is pure artifice borne out of convenience because certain posters don't like the implications and the forum mods don't want to deal with it.
Which is fine.
Because referring to 'Green Scar' is both truer to the comics and eliminates all semantics.
If anybody wants to discuss this, by all means. Otherwise, we're rehashing the explosive
butthurtdebate in the wake of HotM over nothing. In which case:
But it’s neither here or there. Hulk isn’t the only one this happens to. There’s really no distinction between “Byrne Superman” on the forum, and the following years either in terms of ability. But it still gets used as well.
^ I unironically agree with you in the first part but sharply disagree with you in the second part. Let's not foment any sort of false equivalence here.
Even now that this issue has been "resolved" that all of KMC must refer to this version as 'Green Scar', let's not pretend there hasn't been clear hypocrisy over the years.
World War Hulk and Heart of the Monster were being published while KMC was vigorously debating their merits. Then, they were almost immediately subject to a mod ruling. Intentionally or not, the mod ruling artificially bifurcated the then current 616 Hulk in contravention of the then-ongoing comics.
Whereas "Byrne-era" Superman -- and everything that has happened since post-Crisis really -- had been freely left to poster interpretation. All Superman feats from 1986-forward were fair game despite the arguments that as of Flashpoint (2011), we were dealing with a retconned timeline. Mods never actually imposed or enforced a rule that canonically bifurcated Superman (or any DC character) into their pre-Flashpoint versions and post-Flashpoint versions even though that actually would be in line with the then-ongoing comics.
In retrospect, DC going back and forth with their timeline several times thereafter might actually vindicate this one-sidedness. Because, oh look... over a decade later with the publishing of Doomsday Clock 2019 and Death Metal 2020, DC is trying to re-conglomerate their timeline???
Spoiler:
Just ignore New History of the DC Universe #1 for now...
But with Heart of the Monster's on-panel revelation that Green Scar was always holding back, even during World War Hulk #5 when WBH-mode first emerged? Why was the mod ruling imposed in the first place? There was never a Marvel-wide retcon. Heck, WBH emerged in World War Hulk #5 proper. And why is it still there? It's outdated and it ignores the actual comics once Heart of the Monster 2011 was published.
But what we're left with is this:
Marvel character, who during a famous storyline (World War Hulk) and was never actually retconned, must be specifically referred to as 'Green Scar' because people didn't like his 'WBH-mode" being discussed that was revealed on-panel during World War Hulk #5... ??? Nah. Mod ruling. Despite what Heart of the Monster showed on-panel.
Contrasted with:
All DC characters who during an industry-wide event (Flashpoint 2011), and were partially retconned, can enjoy all feats from 1986-forward and don't have to be specifically referred to as 'post-FP' because... ??? Yeah. No restrictions. While you're at it, go ahead and even discuss pre-Crisis feats in certain circumstances due to amorphous insistence that all pre-Crisis feats matter now.
Sure, it may be DC's fault for retconning/rebooting it's timeline so often. But on KMC, it's always been one-sided. None more egregious than the Sentry ruling actually when it comes to actual comic narratives.
These mod rulings are not true to the comics. Because if they were, they'd be implemented both ways across the publishing divide. They're not. They weren't. They're artificially constructed convenience.
But we can still respect these sorts of mod rulings because they might avoid further trolling and because, well, in the case of Hulk all people have to do from now on is cite 'Green Scar'". Not that mods ever forced people to ever cite 'post-FP Superman' years ago, but whatever.
This is all a TL;DR for: Let's not foment any sort of false equivalence here.
This is a DC bias forum. Its been pretty freaking obvious for years. DC doesnt get anything taken away from them. Heck, it's to the point that mods are even discussing pre crisis fts belonging to current characters which also paints a picture on how bias this side of the comic forum is. Lol... they even made a mod ruling that the hercs fts of Hulk swallowing 100 hercs is magical and not a physical ft. They know they are bias. Well, I hope they do, but yes, the bias on this site is as visible as it can get.
Originally posted by Juntai
I’m pretty sure it had more to do with the passage of time. People were using WWH in threads, then later on started using WBH after that story was released.But it’s neither here or there. Hulk isn’t the only one this happens to. There’s really no distinction between “Byrne Superman” on the forum, and the following years either in terms of ability. But it still gets used as well.
That's so weird because
Originally posted by Juntai
In the Byrne era Superman also couldn't survive in space.
Didn't have Freeze Breath.
His powers didn't develop until later in life [where in current comics, he had them since childhood.] and was never Superboy.
Only Green Kryptonite existed. [We have the whole spectrum]
He was the only survivor of Krypton [Not true.]We could go on for pages like this;
Pretty much everything Byrne introduced has zero impact on what came later.
Originally posted by carver9
This is a DC bias forum. Its been pretty freaking obvious for years. DC doesnt get anything taken away from them. Heck, it's to the point that mods are even discussing pre crisis fts belonging to current characters which also paints a picture on how bias this side of the comic forum is. Lol... they even made a mod ruling that the hercs fts of Hulk swallowing 100 hercs is magical and not a physical ft. They know they are bias. Well, I hope they do, but yes, the bias on this site is as visible as it can get.
Yet, when given the chance to give your spiel......you readily agreed, SEVERAL times, to what was being proposed.
I'm really... Truly... Not sure what the problem is here?
People on this forum have simply been using the terms WWH, WBH, and Green Scar differently(often interchangeably) over the ~20 years since the arc's release date. This has always led to confusion... And since those individual terms obviously aren't going anywhere, they've simply been given clearer definitions which should help eliminate said confusion moving forward.
We can get into the minutia of it if you want --individually discuss what everyone thinks "WWH" actually means and all that-- but it doesn't matter? Sounds like even the biggest Hulk enthusiasts can [still] agree that "Green Scar" is the more proper nomenclature anyway, so if you want all of Hulk's showings/abilities from that era accessible to him in a thread, all you have to do is specify that version in the OP... But if you generically use "WWH" in the title, then he defaults to the levels specified (and agreed-upon) in the Ruling Addendum. Very, very simple.
Absolutely nothing was "taken" from Hulk here. There is zero "bias" to this ruling at all(I have NEVER had a dog in this race to begin with, and specifically ASKED you people [looking at you, carv, since you seem to have the most to say now] if things sounded fair and rational before the ruling was even made, lol.) Don't like *how* the versions are defined? That's fine. But don't act like I'm just sitting here trying to f*ck over the entire Marvel fandom from behind-the-scenes, just because I [diplomatically, I might add] added some bits of forum vocabulary to the rules.
Don't gaslight me. 😂
Originally posted by Galan007It's particularly amusing reading this from outside - the ruling is essentially the most inoffensive "Hey, World War Hulk is Green Scar in that specific World War Hulk storyline in his non-WBH mode, but if you want all of his feats just remove the WWH denomination and use Green Scar " - yet the reaction is as if you made them eat shit and started posting scans on how different Hulk incarnations abilities differ.
I'm really... Truly... Not sure what the problem is here?People on this forum have simply been using the terms WWH, WBH, and Green Scar differently(often interchangeably) over the ~20 years since the arc's release date. This has always led to confusion... And since those individual terms obviously aren't going anywhere, they've simply been given clearer definitions which should help eliminate said confusion moving forward.
We can get into the minutia of it if you want --individually discuss what everyone thinks "WWH" actually means and all that-- but it doesn't matter? Sounds like even the biggest Hulk enthusiasts can [still] agree that "Green Scar" is the more proper nomenclature anyway, so if you want all of Hulk's showings/abilities from that era accessible to him in a thread, all you have to do is specify that version in the OP... But if you generically use "WWH" in the title, then he defaults to the levels specified (and agreed-upon) in the Ruling Addendum. Very, very simple.
Absolutely nothing was "taken" from Hulk here. There is zero "bias" to this ruling at all(I have NEVER had a dog in this race to begin with, and specifically ASKED you people [looking at you, carv, since you seem to have the most to say now] if things sounded fair and rational before the ruling was even made, lol.) Don't like *how* the versions are defined? That's fine. But don't act like I'm just sitting here trying to f*ck over the entire Marvel fandom from behind-the-scenes, just because I [diplomatically, I might add] added some bits of forum vocabulary to the rules.
Don't gaslight me. 😂
It's still not to late for either of those -- but they'd probably enjoy at least one.
Originally posted by PhilosophíaBut Green Scar went WBH in World War Hulk #5. So this 'WWH' terminology that offended so many KMC poster sensibilities -- forcing this arbitrary mod ruling -- has never actually explained why the literal climax of World War Hulk should be separated from 'WWH'?
It's particularly amusing reading this from outside - the ruling is essentially the most inoffensive "Hey, World War Hulk is Green Scar in that specific World War Hulk storyline in his non-WBH mode, but if you want all of his feats just remove the WWH denomination and use Green Scar " - yet the reaction is as if you made them eat shit and started posting scans on how different Hulk incarnations abilities differ.It's still not to late for either of those -- but they'd probably enjoy at least one.
By all means, elaborate.
Again - the biggest and loudest Hulk fan was all in favour of the words Galan typed:
Originally posted by carver9
I agree with everything mentioned above.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
👆 its a good change. Am glad we could alll agree on it.
Originally posted by carver9
Yep.
Originally posted by carver9
💃Im so excited. The mods finally did something for me. FINALLY
Originally posted by carver9
I know this stings, lol.
Originally posted by carver9
Youre hurt in the inside. I can tell. My shoulder is always here for you.
Originally posted by carver9
Im comfortable with the ruling.
We were all given a chance to give our views on the words. Again, read Carv's words above - he repeated multiple times (at my insistence) that he was happy with the words. Even agreed with me that it was a good ruling.
I will admit, I was confused myself why Carver was so happy. But I think I gave him way too much credit.