Effects...just "icing" on the cake? (or) not comparable to playing Bach?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Is that all you've got?

You know...like what you just said a vocoder does.

It's the trumpet that turns the sound that the mouth makes into something musical...and with a vocoder, often times you can just simply speak into it, and it's the vocoder that turns the sound the mouth makes into something musical.

You use them both as instruments, because you can be creative with them by pressing the valves, buttons, sliders, knobs, whatever in a creative way.

Look AC. It's right there in front of you. Proof you goofed and you're wrong...again. Does it hurt looking at it?

I'm certain it does. 😎

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
AC...I just proved you're wrong. You got nothing. You NEVER did.

Just let him have the last post, Bardock. We all know he's wrong.

-AC

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
It's not all that clear to be honest...BUT, as I said above...even if in this example it isn't the effect that produces the rhythm, it can be in many other examples. Expecially with a multi-delay pedal...which you could basically end-up making sound like a techno riff.

I wasn't talking about a delay pedal, you were. Clearly I was talking about a 'tremolo and 'wah-pedal'. It was YOUR example and I just proved that your claim (that the effect ALONE made the rythm of the music) is WRONG. Don't discredit the guitar abilities of Marr.

Originally posted by 2D_MASTER
It was definately A tremolo effect. Whether it came from a pedal or from knobs on the amp itself (which is in the case of Johnny Mar). It's still a guitar effect.

Though, not, as I said, a pedal.

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Though, not, as I said, a pedal.

Though, as I said, still a guitar effect.

Originally posted by 2D_MASTER
Though, as I said, still a guitar effect.

Just that it was said to be a pedal while it was never said to not be a guitar effect, which...makes it pretty clear which statement made more sense.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Just that it was said to be a pedal while it was never said to not be a guitar effect, which...makes it pretty clear which statement made more sense.

Jusy trying to avoid discussing things that don't really matter. Whether it was a pedal or built into the amp, it was'nt a sample, and it wasnt a synth. It had no relevancy. But for the sake of avoiding argument, yes, VVD was 'more' correct in saying it wasnt a pedal, if you will.

Originally posted by Bardock42
What? Where? I missed it. Last I checked AC had the facts...

AC said you can't use a vocoder as an instrument...he only thinks instruments are "traditional" forms of expressing yourself musically like a trumpet...(but then also went on to say vocoders alter the sound you mouth makes)

To which I said...

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
You probably missed that part about how your mouth makes a sound and a trumpet alters it.

You know...like what you just said a vocoder does.

It's the trumpet that turns the sound that the mouth makes into something musical...and with a vocoder, often times you can just simply speak into it, and it's the vocoder that turns the sound the mouth makes into something musical.

You use them both as instruments, because you can be creative with them by pressing the valves, buttons, sliders, knobs, whatever in a creative way.

Way to go Bardock!

Originally posted by 2D_MASTER
Though, as I said, still a guitar effect.

YES EVERYONE. It's a guitar EFFECT. I think we all agree with that.

And a guitar EFFECT can be used extremely creatively and innovatively...or it can just be slapped on.

Pedals are pushed, knobs are turned, buttons are pressed (and MOST LIKELY these all happened in the How Soon is Now guitar riff), and IF you do all that stuff creatively, it ..the effects...can be adding more to the music in terms of the personality, vibe, rhythm it's giving it than what has just been played on the initial instrument.

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
Oh this is ridiculous.

YES EVERYONE. It's a guitar EFFECT

Well the argument was in concern to both me and AC having the impression you thought it was a synth or sample, not a GUITAR EFFECT. Don't you remember arguming about that with AC? Finally that was put to rest, well at least I though it was. Whether it was a pedal effect or not was irrelvant, that's all I was trying to say.

Originally posted by 2D_MASTER
Well the argument was in concern to both me and AC having the impression you thought it was a synth or sample, not a GUITAR EFFECT. Don't you remember arguming about that with AC? Finally that was put to rest, well at least I though it was. Whether it was a pedal effect or not was irrelvant, that's all I was trying to say.

NOTE: Added more above.

EP, you BLOW into a trumpet and IT makes the sound.

YOU make the sound and the VOCODER alters it.

Simple. You're wrong and once again EVERYBODY knows it.

-AC

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
And a guitar EFFECT can be used extremely creatively and innovatively...or it can just be slapped on.

Pedals are pushed, knobs are turned, buttons are pressed (and MOST LIKELY these all happened in the How Soon is Now guitar riff), and IF you do all that stuff creatively, it ..the effects...can be adding more to the music in terms of the personality, vibe, rhythm it's giving it than what has just been played on the initial instrument.

So what about what I said regarding what Depeche Mode does...do you agree with that at all?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
EP, you BLOW into a trumpet and IT makes the sound.

YOU make the sound and the VOCODER alters it.

Simple. You're wrong and once again EVERYBODY knows it.

-AC

HA ha...you essentially just said the same thing.

You goofed AC. Face it.

A vocoder CAN BE USED AS AN INSTRUMENT.

(Note: You don't BLOW into a trumpet...you make a sound with your lips).

WRONG AGAIN...because you don't know much about playing or making music. THAT'S a fact

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
A vocoder CAN BE USED AS AN INSTRUMENT.

How? By speaking into it? Then it's not CREATING, it's ALTERING. The same as a microphone.

It can be used as a tool, it's not a musical instrument.

And stop panic posting.

-AC

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES

And how do you KNOW the guitars in How Soon is Now ISN'T for sure a studio effect? (which again, I'm not saying is or isn't ...doesn't matter). What a RIDICULOUS thing to say.

[/B]

True, you never say it was, for sure, a sample or synth. But you certainly believed it COULD be, as your quote above implies. I simply wanted to KILL the idea of it being anything other than a guitar effect.

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
(Note: You don't BLOW into a trumpet...you make a sound with your lips).

"The trumpet is made of brass tubing bent into a rough spiral. Although the bore is roughly cylindrical, it is more precisely a complex series of tapers, smaller at the mouthpiece receiver and larger just before the flare of the bell begins. Careful design of these tapers is critical to the intonation of the instrument. Sound is produced by blowing air through closed lips, producing a 'buzzing' sound into the mouthpiece and starting a standing wave vibration in the air column inside the trumpet.".

You were saying, EP?

You blow into a trumpet, the trumpet makes the sound.

You make the sound, the vocoder alters it.

Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
(WRONG AGAIN...because you don't know much about playing or making music. THAT'S a fact

Same as you, you don't either, that's a fact.

"You make the sound with your lips." Hahahaha.

Either prove you know about making and playing music, or stop saying I don't.

-AC

A microphone...on it's own...is a tool. It doesn't (like something you can use as an instrument) have buttons to push or knobs to turn that can be used in a creative way to be musical with.

You CAN with a vocoder.

You're WRONG.

Please allow us to continue our discussion

Originally posted by 2D_MASTER
True, you never say it was, for sure, a sample or synth. But you certainly believed it COULD be, as your quote above implies. I simply wanted to KILL the idea of it being anything other than a guitar effect.

(When in reality when it comes to music making...he really doesn't know a whole lot).