Intelligence & cunning competition between Thanos and Darkseid

Originally posted by Allankles
That really doesn't matter here. You don't have to be smart to win. This is about the depth of their plotting and scheming as well as their intellect.

To me DS is without doubt the better schemer, pure intelligence is harder one, do you look at the quality of the writing the depth of thought put into every characters schemes? Is that what determines it? Or level of tech creations, in that case DS has the entropy aegis. Doom tubes, devices that can trap beings with multiversal power etc

Again you only need to read Countdown or DONG to know DS is the better schemer, he plays people like chess pieces and he even uses the smallest pawn to further his goals, in that respect he is more subtle than Thanos, DS IS generally more hands-off.

If we go by creations then Thanos still has it. His clones and Omega are far more powerful than anything Darkseid has ever created. He has him beat every which way.

In dong Darkseid failed miserably just because Superman interfered. The source left himself a fallback plan and thats all it took for Ds to lose his advantage. Orion made him back down and later killed him in countdown 2.

In countdown all Ds plans blew up in his face. Hen then got Mary on his side and was stopped by Orion after the Atom already cut him off from the Source. All his plans failed. The heroes stopped him dead in his tracks and orion had to call of the rest so he could pwn Ds on his own.

DS ftw. durband

Originally posted by Badabing
DS ftw. durband

When bada gives his opinion we all lose.

Originally posted by Badabing
DS ftw. durband

durkseid nahuh

Originally posted by quanchi112
Success rate? I think DS has had more successes granted he's been more stories but also more failures because of being in more stories, so we can't compare success rate with a relative fringe character like Thanos.

As far as creations go, making an inferior clone of someone doesn't really count much as a creation. DS has constructed devices to entrap a being with multiversal power and has constructed things like the Entropy Aegis to counter the all-destroying power of Imperiex. He has made devices to control Galactus level beings (a powerful Promethian giant). Thanos best had him making inferior clones of Galactus that were easily destroyed later.

Cunning has to do with the depth of said feats. If your schemes are school boy level you have no right to say you are the better schemer if your competition is coming up with better schemes.

As in DONG and Countdown, here we see the degree and depth of DS' manipulations even taking consideration for the smallest of players all to further his own goals. Thanos' schemes have a lot less depth, so if you want to talk about cunning he looses there and handily.

And his successes and failures in DONG had nothing to do with the degree of his scheming. He got impeded in DONG because the Source entity resurrected Orion and facilitated his amping via the Soul Fire equation (through the Father/Son connection). Superman was a distraction but that's neither here nor there, as you know he ko'd Supes quite quickly the issue was the Source entity resurrecting and amping Orion.

Those are plot devices, again nothing to do with his actual scheming. You think being impeded via plot device had anything to do with his schemes? His schemes are what brought him the power, the rest was a matter of luck and execution after that.

Originally posted by Allankles

Originally posted by Allankles
As far as creations go, making an inferior clone of someone doesn't really count much as a creation. DS has constructed devices to entrap a being with multiversal power and has constructed things like the Entropy Aegis to counter the all-destroying power of Imperiex. He has made devices to control Galactus level beings (a powerful Promethian giant). Thanos best had him making inferior clones of Galactus that were easily destroyed later.

Cunning has to do with the depth of said feats. If your schemes are school boy level you have no right to say you are the better schemer if your competition is coming up with better schemes.

As in DONG and Countdown, here we see the degree and depth of DS' manipulations even taking consideration for the smallest of players all to further his own goals. Thanos' schemes have a lot less depth, so if you want to talk about cunning he looses there and handily.

And his successes and failures in DONG had nothing to do with the degree of his scheming. He got impeded in DONG because the Source entity resurrected Orion and facilitated his amping via the Soul Fire equation (through the Father/Son connection). Superman was a distraction but that's neither here nor there, as you know he ko'd Supes quite quickly the issue was the Source entity resurrecting and amping Orion.

Those are plot devices, again nothing to do with his [B]actual scheming. You think being impeded via plot device had anything to do with his schemes? His schemes are what brought him the power, the rest was a matter of luck and execution after that. [/B]

Ds along with help knew the moment to strike when Ares was vulnerable. Thats all. Which Promethian Giant would you say is Galactus level and why?

Cunning has to do with success. If my plan is more complicated and more intricate yet it fails it was a bad plan. It if works then its a very good plan.

Ds goals fell apart and he was defeated and killed at the end. Orion even had to call off help as he killed Ds on his own. Ds had planned so poorly even if he had killed Orion the rest of the boys were going to annihilate him.

Yes,Ds screwed up because of poor planning. He was distracted by Superman which caused his plan to fall apart. Thats how poor his plan was. Superman's interaction caused the whole thing to unravel.

😂

You shouldnt be comparing Thanos to Darkseid he isnt at Thanos' level. More like Doom vs Seid. Thats close.

darkseid is more cunning that why he a threat to the universe

Originally posted by beast1234
darkseid is more cunning that why he a threat to the universe

hmm

Originally posted by quanchi112
What? He created a more powerful clone than Galactus. He also created powerful clones of himself which threaten all of asgard and the entire universe. 😛

Not likely since they were as dumb as a box of bricks, had less power and could be destroyed very easily, hell they were probably just a little more powerful than Thanos. As far as threatening Pantheons is concerned, DS has done that. He's destroyed countless pantheons of gods (and taken their power) across the universe (not just a single battle against Asgard) and Odin and Asgard itself fears him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Cunning has to do with success. If my plan is more complicated and more intricate yet it fails it was a bad plan. It if works then its a very good plan.

Success isn't congruent with having greater cunning. If my cunning involves punching silly Elders in the face that demonstrates brute strength and/or the incompetence of the Elders. It however doesn't prove that you're more cunning only that the opposition is so poor that your thinking doesn't even have to stray beyond the simplest lateral thought.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes,Ds screwed up because of poor planning. He was distracted by Superman which caused his plan to fall apart. Thats how poor his plan was. Superman's interaction caused the whole thing to unravel.

Please. You don't even try to be logical. DS scheming had nothing at all to do with Superman, and his "defeat" (he still had the power to dominate the Source) was caused by the Source resurrecting Orion with the Soul Fire equation empowering his spirit. Supes wasn't part of his scheme, his scheme was to outmaneuver the Source entity as it eliminated every new god and then strike at the right moment.

Superman just happened to be around. That's what we call a plot device. The events at the final confrontation in DONG had absolutely nothing to do with the scheming DS had been doing throughout the mini.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You shouldnt be comparing Thanos to Darkseid he isnt at Thanos' level. More like Doom vs Seid.

You're right, Doom is probably more subtle and cunning than Thanos.

hey Allankles you have not responed to my message

Originally posted by beast1234
hey Allankles you have not responed to my message

The Orion thing? You never explianed the errors in the bio. Is this in the respect thread? Because if it is there are plenty other people on KMC who can help you out with that.

no is clash of the finest

Search it up on google

they both get headache by trying to outsmart eachother

Originally posted by Allankles
Not likely since they were as dumb as a box of bricks, had less power and could be destroyed very easily, hell they were probably just a little more powerful than Thanos. As far as threatening Pantheons is concerned, DS has done that. He's destroyed countless pantheons of gods (and taken their power) across the universe (not just a single battle against Asgard) and Odin and Asgard itself fears him.

Success isn't congruent with having greater cunning. If my cunning involves punching silly Elders in the face that demonstrates brute strength and/or the incompetence of the Elders. It however doesn't prove that you're more cunning only that the opposition is so poor that your thinking doesn't even have to stray beyond the simplest lateral thought.

Please. You don't even try to be logical. DS scheming had nothing at all to do with Superman, and his "defeat" (he still had the power to dominate the Source) was caused by the Source resurrecting Orion with the Soul Fire equation empowering his spirit. Supes wasn't part of his scheme, his scheme was to outmaneuver the Source entity as it eliminated every new god and then strike at the right moment.

Superman just happened to be around. That's what we call a plot device. The events at the final confrontation in DONG had absolutely nothing to do with the scheming DS had been doing throughout the mini.

You're right, Doom is probably more subtle and cunning than Thanos.

Supes' actions allowed the Source the time to do this. If not for Superman joining the fray darkseid wouldnt have had his attention diverted for this to occur.

Superman was the unknown variable and thats all it took for Seid to lose. He took his eyes off the prize.

Doom isnt as good as Thanos. Thanos is the best at prep and the most successful.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes,Darkseid has destroyed unnamed pantheons off panel. Not as impressive as Thanos becoming supreme or collecting the infinity gems.

Whatever. DS could easily have had the IG gauntlet if he was in Marvel, problem is, getting ultimate power isn't as simple in DC (you don't have dullards like the Elders prancing around with infinity gems).

And this is so irrelevant to the point I argued. We were talking about pantheons, and DS has attacked (and siphoned the power of)countless pantheons including Asgard. Thanos attacking Asgard once pales in comparison to that.

Originally posted by Allankles

And this is so irrelevant to the point I argued. We were talking about pantheons, and DS has attacked (and siphoned the power of)countless pantheons including Asgard. Thanos attacking Asgard once pales in comparison to that.

Originally posted by Priest
IMO Marvels Asgard including Odin is a lot different from Dc's power wise.

Prestige wise yes, but Darkseid is a skyfather with the power of several pantheons at his disposal. The thing is he destroyed other pantheons and left Asgard last because of its power. So it does appear that Asgard is sought of afforded the same status power wise.