The Spartans took on more odds, but the Myrmidons took on a superior force who had the terrain advantage and who were already fortified. That's no easy feat and not many of them even suffered injuries (couple died due to arrows but not many).
The Spartans may still win, but it definitely won't be as easy as some think.
Originally posted by FrothByte
The Spartans took on more odds, but the Myrmidons took on a superior force who had the terrain advantage and who were already fortified. That's no easy feat and not many of them even suffered injuries (couple died due to arrows but not many).The Spartans may still win, but it definitely won't be as easy as some think.
What made the beach crew of Troy superior to the Immortals exactly?
Originally posted by juggerman
What made the beach crew of Troy superior to the Immortals exactly?
On their own? Nothing. I guess I worded my sentence wrong. The Myrmidons took on a force of superior numbers to them. I didn't mean that the myrmidons took on a superior force than what the spartans took on.
As for superiority over the immortals, I don't know how they stack up to each other in terms of martial skill, but the trojans did get attacked on their own turf and they had fortifications in place and they had the better ground. The immortals took on the spartans in the spartan's home turf and with the spartans already fortified and having the better ground.
As for a battle.
The Spartans were more tight-knit, they were more efficient in unison. They would gradually merc the less organized Myrmdons with unified shoves and thrusts when the two front lines are connected...simply because their phalanx was slightly more in sync, they did NOT necessarily have better warriors.
Even an outnumbered Achilles would be quite lethal.
Originally posted by Dolos
Quick observation on the dynamic belief systems of the warriors.Achilles knew he couldn't be bested by anyone.
Leonidas was very aware of his ability to die against superior opponents if one were to come around.
That is perhaps why Achilles was so much more ferocious in combat.
Not true. He knew he was the best but he could be bested/killed just like anybdy.
According to the Achilleid, written by Statius in the 1st century AD, and to no surviving previous sources, when Achilles was born Thetis tried to make him immortal, by dipping him in the river Styx. However, he was left vulnerable at the part of the body by which she held him, his heel[3] (see Achilles heel, Achilles' tendon). It is not clear if this version of events was known earlier. In another version of this story, Thetis anointed the boy in ambrosia and put him on top of a fire, to burn away the mortal parts of his body. She was interrupted by Peleus and abandoned both father and son in a rage.[4]
However, none of the sources before Statius makes any reference to this general invulnerability. To the contrary, in the Iliad Homer mentions Achilles being wounded: in Book 21 the Paeonian hero Asteropaeus, son of Pelagon, challenged Achilles by the river Scamander. He cast two spears at once, one grazed Achilles' elbow, "drawing a spurt of blood".
Interesting. But in the film Achille pretty much admits he can be killed. The boy finds him in the tent with the two hookers and when Achilles is leaving the boy says "They say you cannot be killed" to which Achilles responds "i wouldn't bother with the shield then would i?" Not a direct quote but close enough
I don't why people keep wanking Achilles in this thread.
People do realize that individual Spartans did manage to either duplicate or surpass some of his feats?
The best spear throwing feat goes to a Spartan for that Rhino take down feat. He managed to spear a rhino through the eye that was charging at him, that is better than achilles long range spear throw to take a guy down from the horse.
Leonidas managed to throw a spear through Xerses thrown.
When the one guy's son and the blond hair spartan were doing their little tag team death dance that was just as good as any of achilles rampages.
Leonidas' Captain went through 6-10 guys easily just to get to his son's body without any help. That was very Achilles like. Now I'm not saying any individual Spartan is beating Achilles but people should stop downplaying the Spartans. Each one of the named Spartans were very Achilles lite in their own right. I think any two of them would be able to beat Achilles in a fight.
Also the Spartans just flat out took on so much more than Achilles' men ever did. It's not even close. Elephants, horses, Rhinos, explosives, massive barrages of arrows, superhumanly strong creatures like the Ogre.
The Mymodans took on a beach front that was still only lightly guarded and still being fortified. Good feat but nothing compared to the Spartans.
Originally posted by Newjak
I don't why people keep wanking Achilles in this thread.People do realize that individual Spartans did manage to either duplicate or surpass some of his feats?
The best spear throwing feat goes to a Spartan for that Rhino take down feat. He managed to spear a rhino through the eye that was charging at him, that is better than achilles long range spear throw to take a guy down from the horse.
Leonidas managed to throw a spear through Xerses thrown.
When the one guy's son and the blond hair spartan were doing their little tag team death dance that was just as good as any of achilles rampages.
Leonidas' Captain went through 6-10 guys easily just to get to his son's body without any help. That was very Achilles like. Now I'm not saying any individual Spartan is beating Achilles but people should stop downplaying the Spartans. Each one of the named Spartans were very Achilles lite in their own right. I think any two of them would be able to beat Achilles in a fight.
Also the Spartans just flat out took on so much more than Achilles' men ever did. It's not even close. Elephants, horses, Rhinos, explosives, massive barrages of arrows, superhumanly strong creatures like the Ogre.
The Mymodans took on a beach front that was still only lightly guarded and still being fortified. Good feat but nothing compared to the Spartans.
Cuz he's SEXY!!!!!
Also while the rhino feat showed more accuracy Achilles' throw clearly had more power. The throne i dunno since we dunno what it was made out of.
While the Spartans did go thru more they addmittedly up against mostly unskilled fighters. Only the Immortals posed a siginficant threat and they had help with them.
The Mymodans weren't all that great imo. It was Achilles that did the heavy lifting there. I think it would take more than two of the Spartans to down Achilles but not many more.
Originally posted by juggermanIt's hard to gauge cause when the throw is made from achilles the horsemen had gotten closer.
Cuz he's SEXY!!!!!Also while the rhino feat showed more accuracy Achilles' throw clearly had more power. The throne i dunno since we dunno what it was made out of.
While the Spartans did go thru more they addmittedly up against mostly unskilled fighters. Only the Immortals posed a siginficant threat and they had help with them.
The Mymodans weren't all that great imo. It was Achilles that did the heavy lifting there. I think it would take more than two of the Spartans to down Achilles but not many more.
As far as we know Achilles and his Mymodans went up against exactly the same skilled fighters.
I said two of the 'named' Spartans should be able to take him down since most of them had Achilles like feats on their own.
Originally posted by Newjak
It's hard to gauge cause when the throw is made from achilles the horsemen had gotten closer.As far as we know Achilles and his Mymodans went up against exactly the same skilled fighters.
I said two of the 'named' Spartans should be able to take him down since most of them had Achilles like feats on their own.
True. Going with Achilles for now tho.
No since the Persians were outright stated to be unskilled and scared. The Trojans were superior than the average guys the 300 faced. The Immortals are the exception
Yes i know. I'd say it would take more than two of them. 3-5 would be my guess
Originally posted by juggermanThey were never said to be unskilled they were merely called an army of slaves. As you can tell they obviously had different warrior systems they incorporated into their army.
True. Going with Achilles for now tho.No since the Persians were outright stated to be unskilled and scared. The Trojans were superior than the average guys the 300 faced. The Immortals are the exception
Yes i know. I'd say it would take more than two of them. 3-5 would be my guess
And they became scared because of how skilled the Spartans were and knew death awaited for them should they charge forward. The Trojans really don't have any more feats or any more implied skill than the average Persian warrior.
And even if you do believe that the Spartans still faced far more varied foes like Rhinos and Elephants and much greater numbers.
Like I said feat wise the Trojans Achilles faced weren't any more skilled than what the Spartans went against.
Originally posted by Newjak
They were never said to be unskilled they were merely called an army of slaves. As you can tell they obviously had different warrior systems they incorporated into their army.And they became scared because of how skilled the Spartans were and knew death awaited for them should they charge forward. The Trojans really don't have any more feats or any more implied skill than the average Persian warrior.
And even if you do believe that the Spartans still faced far more varied foes like Rhinos and Elephants and much greater numbers.
Like I said feat wise the Trojans Achilles faced weren't any more skilled than what the Spartans went against.
It's been a while so i can see how i may have been mistaken about them being called unskilled.
Agreed about them facing various opposition.