Originally posted by Q99
What about just bumping Drakon down? I think there's a couple in second that deserve first more than him.Bumping down Drakon and bumping up Diana are two different things.
it goes back to what X just said. i think a consensus has to be reached about whether we allow skill based power to be a contributing factor.
Hm... Dinah and Connor strike me as both lowish in the Top Tier.
in pure skill? maybe connor, but not dinah imo. unless she's like, absolute bottom.
Originally posted by -Pr-
it goes back to what X just said. i think a consensus has to be reached about whether we allow skill based power to be a contributing factor.
I'm not even sure if it's a skill-based power. I think he's simply a metahuman.
His durability to stuff like an explosion also seems rather high.
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Oh, one other proposed change: I'd like to bump the Twelve Brothers in Silk down to tier 3. They were said to be 'near Shiva,' but I think only Rabbit lived up to it. Dinah's team of 7 was able to hold them off pretty well.
Twelve tier 3 fighters of course (perhaps with a few tier 2s in there), still being an absolutely terrifying combat group.
Originally posted by Q99
I'm not even sure if it's a skill-based power. I think he's simply a metahuman.His durability to stuff like an explosion also seems rather high.
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Oh, one other proposed change: I'd like to bump the Twelve Brothers in Silk down to tier 3. They were said to be 'near Shiva,' but I think only Rabbit lived up to it. Dinah's team of 7 was able to hold them off pretty well.
Twelve tier 3 fighters of course (perhaps with a few tier 2s in there), still being an absolutely terrifying combat group.
ive honestly never been sure about his speed.
on that second note, i think Savant should be included. In Second, i think.
Originally posted by StyleTime😂
Nemesis gets no love.Haters! The whole lot of you!
Well, gimme some convincing and I'll second the addition proposal. But a third would probably still be needed for a second tier placement.
Or vote on the others in the giant list of proposals, to weed it down, so that the Nemesis addition becomes more prominent... 😛
Which Nemesis? It's a very commonly used name.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I was always under the assumption that Drakon was "metahuman" only insomuch as Cass or others in the Top Tier were. Most of them have their own feats of incredible physicality.
Some of his feats make me think otherwise. Grabbing dozens of arrows as fast as Connor and Mia could fire them all with his fingertips and not moving his body. Likewise getting multiple shafts at once from Ollie.
Connor could keep up with Shiva and Cass, who're about as fast as you can get (and really Cassandra strains 'peak human' to the limit as-is). He could barely see most of Drakon's moves, and there's times when he's talking to an arrow, they try something, and he's suddenly on the other side of the room.
The explosion thing again. He was caught full-on by an explosion and came out of it with *no* visible damage except for some missing hair (which might've been from the glue arrow that he got!) and the kind of bandaids you use to hide shaving cuts. No burns. No signs of damage from the arrow that went through his foot either. That's either super toughness or a healing factor.
He's got some crazy strength for his size too, but that's less obviously super. Still, casually carrying a guy twice your weight at arms length out a window is possibly metahuman as well.
That kind of difference screams "this is a martial artist who is also superhuman" to me. Stopping arrows from the Arrow family? Believable. All of them? Also believable, but really difficult. Doing it while not dodging or spending apparent effort all with the finger tips while these are fired by 100+ lb draw bows? Treating it almost like a bore? Ehh... if that's not superhuman, then he's uber tier, not top tier.
Originally posted by -Pr-On this inquiry... would Mantis' liberal use of precog with her fighting nullify her placement?
it goes back to what X just said. i think a consensus has to be reached about whether we allow skill based power to be a contributing factor.
Originally posted by Original SmurphI support this. Definitely not misjudging.
I feel like Hawkeye should move from Third to Second, but maybe I'm misjudging.
Originally posted by BlanketI support all of this (although Mar-vell is a moot point now). Also curious as to should Gamora come down, who would rise to take her spot?
Against Mar-vell moving down, against Gamora moving down (lol), against the Wonder Woman move, against Orion (lol), and ya, that should be all.
Originally posted by dmillsI support this.
Iron Fist needs to be bumped up to uber. ASAP.
Originally posted by comicfan11I support this.
Ares Marvel should be higher.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
On this inquiry... would Mantis' liberal use of precog with her fighting nullify her placement?
I wouldn't say so. I don't think it's not constant Ravager/Threeboot Dream Girl "I know all your next moves" stuff most of the time. More visions of the future stuff. Iirc she hasn't always had such a powerful array of psychics either.
She can still nerve-strike out Thor and that's pure skill. Heck, there's only a few top-tiers that I think could pull off some of her fights even if they had added pre-cog.
Also curious as to should Gamora come down, who would rise to take her spot?
No-one, Transcend doesn't need it's spots full.
^ Her enhancements don't have anything to do with her equal mastery of armed and unarmed techniques from AT LEAST 83.4% of known space faring cultures as per the Worldmind. She's just that adept. Even side by side with Mantis, her enhancements still play second fiddle to her skill, e.g., Guardians of the Galaxy #24.
-I should note that movement of either Canary or Drakon down without replacement will simply result in a vacant DC top tier slot.
-Ares (DC) will be entered into the hierarchy at second, if that proposal remains unopposed, at the next update.
-Can people weigh in on the huge list below, before we move onto any new additions or changes for a bit? Particularly the Old Proposed Changes.
Proposed Additions' Entry Points
Darkseid to second tier: 1 [Gecko4lif] /
Darkseid to fourth tier: 1 [Omega] /
Nemesis to second tier: 1 [Style] /
Kanto to second tier: 2 [Omega, comicfan] /
Mera to third: 1 [Omega] / 1 [comicfan]
Tombstone to fourth: 1 [Omega] /
Caiera to third: 1 [Omega] /
Spider-Man to fourth: 1 [Omega] /
Juggernaut to fourth: 1 [Omega] /
Faora to second:1 [Omega] /
Lex Luthor to fourth: 1 [Omega] /
Ares (DC) to second: 3 [Omega, Q99, comicfan] /
Catman to second?: 1 [srank] /
Savant to second: 1 [Pr] /
Old Proposed Changes
Jubilee to third: 3 [Cresh, Q99, Konton] / 4 [llag, Nataku, Blanket, Style]
Kingpin to second: 5 [V, jrod, srank, capt, Accel] / 6 [Soljer, llag, Macoy, Nataku, Blanket, Style]
Moon Knight to second: 4 [llagrok, Fake McCoy, Alfheim, Mungi] / 4 [Soljer, capt, endrict, Blanket]
Midnighter to second: 2 [Soljer, Blanket] / 3 [Style, endrict, srank]
Blade to second: 4 [snoop, endrict, Darth Martin, Blanket] / 4 [Style, llagrok, capt, srank]
New Proposed Changes
Constantine Drakon to second: 1 [Q99] / 1 [srank]
Tim Drake to second: 2 [Pr, MM] / 1 [Konton]
Alpha to second: 1 [Q99] /
Mad Dog Cain to second: 1 [Q99] /
Gamora to uber: 6 [Omega, Konton, Boubonmaster, Q99, jalek, srank?] / 4 [ODG, Blanket, Smurph, SuperiorTech]
Black Canary to second: 2 [Omega, Pr] / 1 [srank]
Aquaman to third: 2 [Omega, comicfan] /
Merlyn (DC) to third: 1 [comicfan] /
Ares (Marvel) to second: 2 [ODG, comicfan] /
Mister Terrific to second: 2 [Omega, comicfan] /
Hercules to second: 1 [comicfan] /
Iron Fist to uber: 2 [ODG, dmills] / 1 [srank]
Twelve Brothers to third: 1 [Q99] /