Would Naruto be weak without the nine tails and sage mode?

Originally posted by socool8520
Did it ever state anywhere that Naruto needed Kurama do to mass clones? He's been able to do it since the early chapters of the manga. He didn't ever need Kurama until Haku, who was a pretty powerful ninja at the time.

Without Kurama, he wouldn't have been hated by everyone, would still have his parents (One being one of the top geniuses in the manga), which means expert instruction in techniques, and his already high chakra levels due to bloodline. so basically, he could have been a potential Minato with even higher chakra stores. 😛 He'd have been fine.

It's implied. Small amounts of Kurama's chakra merge with Naruto's own chakra, and increase his base levels of chakra. For 12 years, Naruto's regular chakra levels had kept increasing. Ergo, yes, he needed Kurama to create hundreds of Shadow Clones. He definitely would not have been able to make upwards of a hundred clones with just his own chakra had Kurama not been sealed inside him. His chakra levels would be somewhere between Sasuke's & Orochimaru's at best.

Eh, the question is just asking how Naruto strong would be if he didn't have Kurama & Sage Mode, not what his life would be like if Kurama was never sealed inside him. Much like asking what Sasuke's life would be like if he never got the Sharingan, not what his life would be like if Itachi never killed their parents. It is a stupid question IMO, but meh.

His chakra levels would be somewhere between Sasuke's & Orochimaru's at best.

Ah, I'd say maybe a bit better. Uzumaki is a specific chakra-heavy bloodline after all.

Originally posted by Damborgson
I thought that too, but seeing as how Haku chose not to kill Sasuke, I assume he'd have done the same with Naruto. He'd have killed them both from the get go had he felt like it.

True, but without Kyuubi Haku would have easily incapacitated Sasuke and Naruto, and would have helped Zabuza with Kakashi, Kakashi probably dying there as well.

It is unlikely that Zabuza would leave Naruto and Sasuke alive.

Or he'd just kill them both. Kakashi has a habit of doing that.

I did not read all of the thread so forgive me if I repeat stuff.

Naruto would be an even better ninja had he not be given the 9-tails.

Kurama's chakra mixing with his own certainly gives him a chakra boost but Naruto already had naturally high levels of chakra...absurdly high levels. Doing sage training requires absurdly high levels of chakra. Kurama's chakra interfered with that. He still mastered it better than anyone before. His chakra also has to be high enough to counteract Kurama's or he will die. What does that mean? Naruto has natural chakra levels on par with the most powerful tailed beast (besides the 10-tails, obviously). I won't say that Naruto has the highest natural chakra levels of any character...but it seems like he does.

That said, much of his issues come from being hated for having the tailed beast. He was shunned and outcast. Had he not been outcast, he would not be a delinquent. Had he not be a delinquent, he would have been able to focus on his studies and practice harder. With his already absurdly high chakra levels and his ridiculous genius withOUT his delinquency, he's be among the most talented and powerful ninjas before the time-skip: easily.

So when people stupidly say Haku would have killed him (Haku would not have...he did not want to kill anyone), they are wrong. He would have already been a superb ninja by the time he fought Haku.

NARUTO would be a fine NINJA without the 9tails, remember that in the beginning, the reason why NARUTO could not do a decent jutsu is primarily due to the 9tails CHAKRA messing with his.

this kind of thread reminds me why the sakura hate in almost all forums is pretty absurd.

sakura is the only one without any clan buffs but is one of the smartest and most studious of them all. she basically became a mini tsunade in the timeskip (sasuke got his sannin amps for free and naruto had thousands of clones over the coarse of his study), so with that in mind, under other top ninja's tutelage she could stack tons more abilities to her repertoire. the sky's the limit with medicine., after all.....

....kabuto. he even incorporated kekkei genkai to his powerset.

naruto's too retarded to go very far minus kyuubi

Well Sasuke didn't really get his Sanin amps for free. He kinda stole them humorously enough. Can't fault the guy for that. The MS/EMS was pretty much handed to him in as much as they could have been.

Originally posted by Q99
Ah, I'd say maybe a bit better. Uzumaki is a specific chakra-heavy bloodline after all.

A 12 year old Naruto without Kurama? I really don't see why he'd be above Orochimaru in terms of chakra capacity. It is not like Sasuke has low to average levels of chakra either.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
this kind of thread reminds me why the sakura hate in almost all forums is pretty absurd.

sakura is the only one without any clan buffs but is one of the smartest and most studious of them all. she basically became a mini tsunade in the timeskip (sasuke got his sannin amps for free and naruto had thousands of clones over the coarse of his study), so with that in mind, under other top ninja's tutelage she could stack tons more abilities to her repertoire. the sky's the limit with medicine., after all.....

....kabuto. he even incorporated kekkei genkai to his powerset.

naruto's too retarded to go very far minus kyuubi

Let's all hate on Hinata, who was weak despite possessing KG.

hinata's not even that weak, she just has a passive personality (possibly being made to fight against her will even), but naruto's inspiration makes her emboldened enough to train harder and embrace her potential

neji was right

Originally posted by psycho gundam
this kind of thread reminds me why the sakura hate in almost all forums is pretty absurd.

sakura is the only one without any clan buffs but is one of the smartest and most studious of them all. she basically became a mini tsunade in the timeskip (sasuke got his sannin amps for free and naruto had thousands of clones over the coarse of his study), so with that in mind, under other top ninja's tutelage she could stack tons more abilities to her repertoire. the sky's the limit with medicine., after all.....

....kabuto. he even incorporated kekkei genkai to his powerset.

naruto's too retarded to go very far minus kyuubi

that's what's wrong with the manga, or at least the majority of the people that consume it; if the guy isn't dbz level, they're shit.

sakura becomes a goddamn surgeon in 2 years and soon after helps take down and counteract the poison of one if not the greatest poison users in the manga but it's not good enough lol. she did well considering the tone of the manga and the inevitability of the plot.

guys like kiba and the rest barely appear and really just got a little bit better at what limited stuff they do have, yet no hate. "oh but sakura hasn't gotten over sasuke", she's a phucking girl, have you ever met one of those? some people get a tattoo of their significant other's name on their arm, madara has his boyfriend's face glued to his heart, but i guess he has god powers so it's okay.

what has she actually failed at? if anything obito, nagato, and madara failed or will fail ultimately

Originally posted by psycho gundam
hinata's not even that weak, she just has a passive personality (possibly being made to fight against her will even), but naruto's inspiration makes her emboldened enough to train harder and embrace her potential

neji was right

Hating on her because she was/is weak is ridiculous. Hating on her because she's largely been a waste of space is justified.

All of my problems with Hinata would be solved if she wasn't a ninja. Or maybe she was one because her father forces her to be one since she is from an important clan.

She's not very strong, she doesn't make a good effort for trying to get strong, and most importantly her temperament just isn't very good for a ninja.

Also I'm glad Psycho and I will always agree on Chiyo and Sakura kicking ass.

That was a pretty awesome fight. My only gripe with it as of now is that it robbed us of further Deidara-Sasori interactions, which were lulzy. Had to wait until they were resurrected.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
that's what's wrong with the manga, or at least the majority of the people that consume it; if the guy isn't dbz level, they're shit.

sakura becomes a goddamn surgeon in 2 years and soon after helps take down and counteract the poison of one if not the greatest poison users in the manga but it's not good enough lol. she did well considering the tone of the manga and the inevitability of the plot.

guys like kiba and the rest barely appear and really just got a little bit better at what limited stuff they do have, yet no hate. "oh but sakura hasn't gotten over sasuke", she's a phucking girl, have you ever met one of those? some people get a tattoo of their significant other's name on their arm, madara has his boyfriend's face glued to his heart, but i guess he has god powers so it's okay.

what has she actually failed at? if anything obito, nagato, and madara failed or will fail ultimately

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
That was a pretty awesome fight. My only gripe with it as of now is that it robbed us of further Deidara-Sasori interactions, which were lulzy. Had to wait until they were resurrected.

Indeed. Deidara and Sasori are by far my favorite Akatsuki team(including Tobi when he joins).

Originally posted by KAIKAGE
My word I'm not denying she is second from the top at being a medical ninja, I'm talking about her combat skills and the fact that the only significant enemy she's beaten is Sasori and that was because she got a lot of help from lady Chiyo. And as illogical as girls are they would still have moved on by now especially after almost getting murdered by the person there infatuated with, its just they built a lot of drama and potential between Naruto and Sakura and instead of Sakura doing the strong and brave thing of moving on from Sasuke and accept the significant feelings she's shown towards Naruto she dwells on Sasuke and sits back and lets Hinata claim Naruto. I just find Sakura the most pathetic of the main characters, the only thing to admire about her is her intelligence and natural ability in the medical field, she keeps whining about only being able to do the little things for Naruto that anyone could do when the most significant thing she could do for him she can't bring herself to do. Anyway lets get off this subject I'm tired of ranting about bloody Sakura Haruno.

Naruto didn't move on after Sasuke tried to kill him. Even ignored Hinata's confession and boobs because he was worried about Sasuke. Trufax.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Naruto didn't move on after Sasuke tried to kill him. Even ignored Hinata's confession and boobs because he was worried about Sasuke. Trufax.

Naruto's creed and life goal is ultimately dependent on sasuke's rehabilitation, like the theme of this manga is "star-crossed lovers" now and it stars naruto and sasuke. Sakura's love for sasuke is overshadowed by naruto's, he doesn't even care about a girl that's been tossing her vag at him for years.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Indeed. Deidara and Sasori are by far my favorite Akatsuki team(including Tobi when he joins).

Same here, now that I think about it. Pity we didn't get to see them fight together. Would have been interesting.

Hidan-Kakuzu was probably my second favourite team, even if Kakuzu was a hard-ass.

Deidara and Sasori was also my favorite Akutski team. I liked Kakuzu, but I thought Hidan was weak sauce. Kakuzu and Oro would have been pretty cool imo