Originally posted by abhilegend
Carver is drunk again it seems. Where the hell was wonder woman working both of them by strength. All she did against Zod was to re-direct his HV back at him and knee him while Superman was dealing with Faora.
Looks like a pimp punch to me.
They didn't land a single hit on Wondy...not one. She worked them. Sorry bro.
Interesting to see what Blue thinks of this. Wonder Woman couldn't even make Darkseid budge from behind with the lasso around his neck who then overpowered her with one hand.
"We need you. We need Superman."
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/11073454/JusticeLeague_6_TheGroup_015.jpg.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/11073456/JusticeLeague_6_TheGroup_016.jpg.html
Interesting choice of words batman, didn't you know that wonder woman was stronger than Superman there?
mmm
Originally posted by carver9
Looks like a pimp punch to me.They didn't land a single hit on Wondy...not one. She worked them. Sorry bro.
That's called a strength showing. Learn to differentiate between those.
Wonder Woman was more skilled than all of them, that's true. She didn't work both of them otherwise she would've won that round by her own. That's not what happened.
I heard Zod beats the shit out of Diana next time, only for Superman to finally cut loose and pushes his shit in on CBR bro. Have a tissue ready.
mhmm
Strength Ranking:DCNU
Originally posted by ares834Uncuffed WW got beat by the First Born.
There is absolutely no reason to put her above the guy who wrecked Apollo.
Problem 1, already covered a page or more ago, is that the First Born beat Apollo, too.
Problem 2, worth mentioning, and why there is special note in my list, is that Superman only "wrecked" Apollo because Apollo's power
happens to exponentially increase Superman's own power, quite unlike First Born,
who, not having that same accident of birth and blessing, was forced to slog through everything Apollo dished out.
Note how the Superman/Apollo fight went prior to the sunburst from Apollo's eyes:
http://oi58.tinypic.com/20723aq.jpg
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Not TOO bad ...
Superman is casually swatted away, as I wrote earlier,
and Strife mocks Wonder Woman, but Superman gets out of the vat he's
been knocked into and scores a speedy high momentum punch that knocks Apollo off his feet.
Apollo seems more indignant than hurt, but it's still an impressive feat given what Apollo has endured to this point in DCnU without losing his footing.
But now, of course, Superman has been given a mega dose of yellow sun energy.
That's significant.
It's not some minor thing.
Even if we didn't have Superman's own narration in the next panel to guide us,
we can see how even a SMALL amount of sunlight has remarkable power-granting boosts for Kryptonians:
(The last two scans are the significant ones.
I largely include the rest for future reference and your reading enjoyment.)
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Supergirl #4
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So just a few rays of sun recovers a Kryptonian who has been held at length in a stasis field near green kryptonite, of all things.
To the point where a high tech
security detail is nigh useless.
How much more so what Apollo delivered?
We are told in the narration:
[i]
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" ... [T]hat sun. Whoa. Feels like I just drank a bucket of adrenaline.
I could bring this whole mountain down on this guy's head.
I could do it with one finger.
Easy. He might deserve it, but he's still her brother ... "
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Originally posted by carver9
She was baby sitting...of course she didn't win it on her own but when she fought the both of them, they got worked.
Or how powerful she is when Superman rescues her against Ocean Master who had her helpless in his tornado.
"Superman is the most powerful being on planet." while Wonder Woman was standing right there. That's two statements in his favor.
She must've been baking some good sandwiches for him.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Ah classic carver again, she punched Zod a few times and that's how she worked him even though Zod never even punched her once. Tell me how hard Superman worked Diana here.Or how powerful she is when Superman rescues her against Ocean Master who had her helpless in his tornado.
"Superman is the most powerful being on planet." while Wonder Woman was standing right there. That's two statements in his favor.
She must've been baking some good sandwiches for him.
Lol...you post a scan of Wonder Woman rapping Superman up in her lasso and her TALKING to him (instead of attacking), trying to help him, as some type of proof against my statement. Really?
Huh? First page, Wonder Woman beats on Faora and redirects Zod heat vision back at him. She burn Faoro face and flies over and punch Zod in the face. She tells Superman to handle Faora (since she is already damaged, etc) while she fights Zod. Zod breaks Superman arm while WW is handling Faora yet again. Wonder Woman then toss Faora to the side like a hush puppie (you know, the same Faora Superman is having a hard time against here and WW had to blitz over to save him...
Hahaha...wait, did you really post Ocean master trapping WW in THE SAME WHIRLPOOL HE TRAPPED THE JLA IN INCLUDING SUPERMAN. Did you really go there? Of course he saved her, since, well, he was in the vicinity. It's not like Superman was trapped in the same attack, freed himself and saved her. When Ocean Master attacked him, he was just as trapped as her.
Originally posted by carver9Yes, because that one bitchslap took her out of the fight and he easily broke out of her lasso which she can't do herself?
Lol...you post a scan of Wonder Woman rapping Superman up in her lasso and her TALKING to him (instead of attacking), trying to help him, as some type of proof against my statement. Really?
Huh? First page, Wonder Woman beats on Faora and redirects Zod heat vision back at him. She burn Faoro face and flies over and punch Zod in the face.That's working them over? 😂
She tells Superman to handle Faora (since she is already damaged, etc) while she fights Zod. Zod breaks Superman arm while WW is handling Faora yet again. Wonder Woman then toss Faora to the side like a hush puppie (you know, the same Faora Superman is having a hard time against here and WW had to blitz over to save him...WTF are you talking about Superman having a hard time against Faora? He tossed her and Zod both aside at the same time.
How many times do I have to show you that scan again?
Hahaha...wait, did you really post Ocean master trapping WW in THE SAME WHIRLPOOL HE TRAPPED THE JLA IN INCLUDING SUPERMAN.Not the same whirlpool, Superman rescued her from the one which she couldn't get out of. You haven't actually read the issue, did you?
Did you really go there? Of course he saved her, since, well, he was in the vicinity. It's not like Superman was trapped in the same attack, freed himself and saved her. When Ocean Master attacked him, he was just as trapped as her.So, him saving her and dispersing the tornado means he was just in vicinity? Hahaha, remind me why I'm talking to your superman hating agenda again?
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes, because that one bitchslap took her out of the fight and he easily broke out of her lasso which she can't do herself?That's working them over? 😂 WTF are you talking about Superman having a hard time against Faora? He tossed her and Zod both aside at the same time.
How many times do I have to show you that scan again?
Not the same whirlpool, Superman rescued her from the one which she couldn't get out of. You haven't actually read the issue, did you? So, him saving her and dispersing the tornado means he was just in vicinity? Hahaha, remind me why I'm talking to your superman hating agenda again?
I never argued or will argue if Superman.can punch a non fighting back Diana. I agree with you there buddy.
Wonder Woman had the advantage against them the entire fight, to the point where Zod took her threat seriously and didn't dispute her on her words of killing him. You're blind to it because it involves your boy. Remind me again why I am debating with you about Superman and Wonder Woman.
Lol...him tossing them to the side doesn't override everything else that happened during that issue. Zod broke his arm like a twig and did it easily and had him by the neck and was about to kill him until Zod was threatened by Wondy. Let this been Superman instead of Wonder Woman that did this, you would be all over it.
Prove that it isnt the same whirlpool that TRAPPED Superman. I'll be waiting.
Originally posted by carver9Of course you did. Who said she wasn't fighting back? Its not like he suddenly attacked her, he was HVing her before that scene.
I never argued or will argue if Superman.can punch a non fighting back Diana. I agree with you there buddy.
Superman didn't want to fight her and still took her out of the fight with a bitchslap.
Wonder Woman had the advantage against them the entire fight, to the point where Zod took her threat seriously and didn't dispute her on her words of killing him.You're taking "perhaps" too far. She had the advantage against Faora but never looked dominant against Zod. In fact that's why she sent Superman to fight Zod.
You're blind to it because it involves your boy.Nah, I know what exactly happened. Wonder Woman looked peerish with Faora with far more skilled in combat and that's it. You're twisting it as if that proves Wonder Woman was stronger than Superman there. She was not. Your superman hate is legendary at this point though.
Remind me again why I am debating with you about Superman and Wonder Woman.Because you don't know how to read a scan.
Lol...him tossing them to the side doesn't override everything else that happened during that issue.Of course it does. It proves he was stronger than either of them.
Zod broke his arm like a twig and did it easily and had him by the neck and was about to kill him until Zod was threatened by Wondy.He broke his arm by his joint with both arms. That's a skill showing, not a strength showing. Zod was weaker than Superman yet dominated him with skill.
Let this been Superman instead of Wonder Woman that did this, you would be all over it.Nah, because Superman regularly rescues her. She is a weakass anyway. Just look at Darkseid choking her when Superman rescues her.
Prove that it isnt the same whirlpool that TRAPPED Superman. I'll be waiting.Easy, superman dispersed this tornado while he couldn't do with the latter tornado. Obviously the second tornado was more powerful. But that's beyond your grasp. SMH.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Of course you did. Who said she wasn't fighting back? Its not like he suddenly attacked her, he was HVing her before that scene.Superman didn't want to fight her and still took her out of the fight with a bitchslap.
You're taking "perhaps" too far. She had the advantage against Faora but never looked dominant against Zod. In fact that's why she sent Superman to fight Zod. Nah, I know what exactly happened. Wonder Woman looked peerish with Faora with far more skilled in combat and that's it. You're twisting it as if that proves Wonder Woman was stronger than Superman there. She was not. Your superman hate is legendary at this point though. Because you don't know how to read a scan.
Of course it does. It proves he was stronger than either of them. He broke his arm by his joint with both arms. That's a skill showing, not a strength showing. Zod was weaker than Superman yet dominated him with skill. Nah, because Superman regularly rescues her. She is a weakass anyway. Just look at Darkseid choking her when Superman rescues her.
Easy, superman dispersed this tornado while he couldn't do with the latter tornado. Obviously the second tornado was more powerful. But that's beyond your grasp. SMH.
Lol...so her blocking heat vision and talking to him (again, instead of attacking when be was rapped up) is her fighting. You might as well post her fighting GL and Superman intervening and her kicking him across the city. Same crap.
I'm not taking perhaps any kind of way. Zod had Superman dead to rights and was going to kill him until WW threatened him. He backed down from her...even stop fighting (before this, they was all about taking out Superman until WW showed up). He knew what she was capable of to the point that he didn't want to fight anymore...the guy retreated. Yeah, he knew she meant what she said and she was capable of doing it. I never said WW is step.get than Superman...ok correction some issues that I seen in your post. You are clearly downplaying the ft.
Prove that he broke his arm by joint dislocation. Then, also explain to me (since Superman is so much stronger than Zod) how could Zod have Superman in the air with one hand, on the verge of killing him.
Lol...of course Superman can disperse an attack that isn't, well, attacking him. When he was hit by THE SAME ATTACK, he was helpless.
Originally posted by carver9Of course it is.
Lol...so her blocking heat vision and talking to him (again, instead of attacking when be was rapped up) is her fighting.
You might as well post her fighting GL and Superman intervening and her kicking him across the city. Same crap.Not at all. Superman didn't expect the attack and all it did was push him away. The bitchslap actually took her out of the fight before Eros defeated the sirens. You haven't actually read the story, have you?
I'm not taking perhaps any kind of way.Of course you are.
Zod had Superman dead to rights and was going to kill him until WW threatened him.Due to his warrior skills, nothing to do with strength.
He backed down from her...even stop fighting (before this, they was all about taking out Superman until WW showed up).That's as wrong as it gets, he wasn't trying to kill superman. At least read the story, he backed down because Diana would've killed Faora.
He knew what she was capable of to the point that he didn't want to fight anymore...the guy retreated.Because of a few punches when he doesn't even knows her name yet? You're laughable, he retreated because he didn't want Faora to get killed.
Yeah, he knew she meant what she said and she was capable of doing it.When the **** did he ever say that? Perhaps doesn't means agreeing with someone, it means there can be a possibility. Good god.
I never said WW is step.get than Superman...ok correction some issues that I seen in your post. You are clearly downplaying the ft.Oh shut up, I can see through your transparent agenda as clear as day. What are you trying to say here? That wonder woman was more skilled but weaker than Superman?
Prove that he broke his arm by joint dislocation.Can you read scans carter? He gripped his arm with both of his arms around that location and broke it. That's a classic way to illustrate breaking someone's arm by joints.
Then, also explain to me (since Superman is so much stronger than Zod) how could Zod have Superman in the air with one hand, on the verge of killing him.Because Superman just had his arm broken carter. Superman wasn't even struggling to free his throat from Zod.
Lol...of course Superman can disperse an attack that isn't, well, attacking him.When he entered the tornado, it automatically attacked him. Have you ever went inside a twister?
When he was hit by THE SAME ATTACK, he was helpless.Same attack of different magnitude of power carter. Its like teaching rocket science to a child. Ocean master trapped diana in a tornado which Superman dispersed, Ocean Master created a tornado which had Superman helpless. In carter's world that means both were identical!!!
Good god. Pr was right, you actually hate superman. There can be no other explanation for such inane views as yours.
Originally posted by carver9
Lol...so her blocking heat vision and talking to him (again, instead of attacking when be was rapped up) is her fighting. You might as well post her fighting GL and Superman intervening and her kicking him across the city. Same crap.I'm not taking perhaps any kind of way. Zod had Superman dead to rights and was going to kill him until WW threatened him. He backed down from her...even stop fighting (before this, they was all about taking out Superman until WW showed up). He knew what she was capable of to the point that he didn't want to fight anymore...the guy retreated. Yeah, he knew she meant what she said and she was capable of doing it. I never said WW is step.get than Superman...ok correction some issues that I seen in your post. You are clearly downplaying the ft.
Prove that he broke his arm by joint dislocation. Then, also explain to me (since Superman is so much stronger than Zod) how could Zod have Superman in the air with one hand, on the verge of killing him.
Lol...of course Superman can disperse an attack that isn't, well, attacking him. When he was hit by THE SAME ATTACK, he was helpless.
Meant to say...I never said WW is stronger or as strong as Superman. That dispute is for others but downplaying her fts...yes, I had to jump in.
Originally posted by carver9
Meant to say...I never said WW is stronger or as strong as Superman. That dispute is for others but downplaying her fts...yes, I had to jump in.
Nearly exactly 2 years ago, on an entirely different non-KMC message boards, a poster presented Superman #6 as "proof"
that DCnU Superman was stronger than DCnU Supergirl.
I copied and pasted the page and e-mailed it to myself because it was an interesting discussion, quite long and involved.
The man's screen alias was Rainzo.
The following, re-edited now to fit KMC formatting, is one of the more pertinent messages sent in that exchange in response to him.
I'm breaking it into 2 posts for read-ability.
Keep in mind, again, though, this is from roughly 2 years ago.
Some things have changed since then, arguably demonstrably so.
Originally posted by rainzoI simply don't get this!
Before the link was broken, we see the "Eradicator" giving Kara multiple punches before Lois starts screaming
"Superman!Stop! You're killing her!" pg. 6.
and that is when supergirl lands a hit on the "Eradicator".
True or False? Just re-read the entire comic and there was never a time when Supergirl dominated the battle whatsoever! When superman lost to this infestation, he wasnt over powered physically like supergirl was! And saying supergirl was shut down?
There is no prove to that! he grabs supergirl as she tries to punch him, blasts her with a beam blows her away
and super speed punches her ... that is called OVER POWERING!!
If the "Eradicator" had the power to shut "beings" down -which is just absurd- why didn't it do that to superman!
This "shutting supergirl" hypothesis is just -_-.
No offence to you guys though.
Originally posted by rainzo
I simply don't get this!
I know! That's why I'm here discussing this with you!
Originally posted by rainzo
Before the link was broken, we see the "Eradicator" giving Kara multiple punches
We do. Or at least it's heavily implied.
Originally posted by rainzo
Lois starts screaming "Superman!Stop! You're killing her!" pg. 6.
She does! Page 6! Just like you said!
Originally posted by rainzo
that is when supergirl lands a hit on the "Eradicator".
That is when Supergirl lands a hit on Eradicator!
She smacks him good!
Originally posted by rainzo
True or False.
It's true! Or true enough for MY tastes!
Maybe give or take a few seconds for him to scream beforehand, but true!
We are in agreement!
Originally posted by rainzo
Just re-read the entire comic and there was never a time
when Supergirl dominated the battle whatsoever!
There isn't! She's totally dominated by him!
Eradicator runs right over her!
He nearly, like, eradicated her and stuff ... !
Eradicator rules!!
Originally posted by rainzo
When Superman lost to this infestation, he wasn't over
powered physically like Supergirl was!
So, this is where we start having problems.
For starters, even in Superman form, Eradicator IS the infestation.
Proof is that he dissolves into a sort of "insect" mass at the end of his final battle with Superman.
But so is the beast in Superman #2 knocking Clark all over the city.
And so is the ice creature of Superman #3.
And so is the fire creature in Superman #1.
And so, too is the fake Clark fighting Kara.
All of these are the Eradicator. And at all times Eradicator is really this cloud of supernanobugs.
He doesn't betray the same properties as your run-of-the-mill brawler/flyer/tank.
He doesn't attack quite the same way.
He's not vulnerable to quite the same class of forces.
You're trying to equate Eradicator with some flying brick like Thor or Superman himself and saying Eradicator is a perfect stand-in for Superman.
He's not.
You're saying there is no "second layer" to his assault on either Kara or Kal.
There is. Kara even starts to tell Eradicator, thinking it is Superman, that he's nuts to think his "Heat Vision" will be an effective weapon against her.
To her surprise, it is.
Meanwhile, her own is almost ineffective against HIM.
Does that scene makes sense as a whole if Eradicator and Superman really ARE identically powered beings?
Part Two of the above post response to rainzo, or
"Does Superman #6 prove Superman is stronger than Supergirl?"
The answer is "No."
It does not.
Originally posted by rainzo
Supergirl was shut down? There is no prove to that!
It's "proof". Not "prove".
If you want to say there's no proof the "reconfigure" blast didn't shut Supergirl down
despite the fact that she doesn't fight back after that point, though she did at every previous point in the fight,
AND despite the fact that a reporter comments on her change in behavior ...?
Go ahead and say that.
But you need to admit that there is no proof that she wasn't shut down, either.
Especially when the Eradicator did the same thing to Superman for the better part of 2 issues:
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Source: Superman #5
Writer: George Perez
Penciller: Nicola Scott
(Actual) Release Date: January 2012
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Originally posted by rainzo
[Eradicator] grabs Supergirl as she tries to punch him,
blasts her with a beam blows her away and super speed
punches her ... that is called OVER POWERING!!
In some contexts that is true.
But it's generally considered true where power is overcoming active resistance from another fighter.
There's no proof that Supergirl was actively resisting Eradicator at that point, and the reporter's comments seem to corroborate that.
You ask me to prove that Supergirl was being shut down?
Prove to me that Supergirl was actively fighting Eradicator after that "reconfigure" beam.
Originally posted by rainzo
If the "Eradicator" had the power to shut "beings" down
-which is just absurd- why didn't it do that to Superman!
Eradicator DID do that to Superman.
Why do you think Clark had those blackouts in Superman #4 and couldn't remember how he got from Smallville to Metropolis and other locales?
And that was BEFORE the near-COMPLETE takeover of him at the end of issue #4 and the bulk of Superman #5.
Originally posted by rainzo
This "shutting supergirl" hypothesis is just -_-.
No offence to you guys though.
I'm not offended.
But your statements are proof you haven't read Superman #s 4, 5, and 6.
If you did, you did not understand what you read, for you wouldn't be telling me Eradicator did NOT shut Superman down if you HAD read Superman 4 and 5,
because that is precisely what he did.
And no, I wouldn't swear on a Bible or anything, but
GIVEN that Eradicator shut Superman down in issues 4 and 5,
GIVEN that Supergirl alluded to the fact that ordinary Kryptonian heat vision should not significantly affect her and did,
GIVEN that Kara fought back before the "reconfigure" blast but did not do so afterward,
GIVEN that a reporter commented on her strange lack of resistance afterwards,
GIVEN that Eradicator made the comment on "reconfiguring matrix" right before that beam, saying the "alien girl" will "suffice",
reconfiguring matrix being what he said right before his take over of Clark at the end of Superman #4, and
GIVEN that Clark made it a point to say he had finally gotten control of Eradicator's nanotechnology himself,
yes, I feel fairly confident that Eradicator "shut Supergirl down" as all of the above clues of the arc suggests.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Of course it is. Not at all. Superman didn't expect the attack and all it did was push him away. The bitchslap actually took her out of the fight before Eros defeated the sirens. You haven't actually read the story, have you?Of course you are. Due to his warrior skills, nothing to do with strength. That's as wrong as it gets, he wasn't trying to kill superman. At least read the story, he backed down because Diana would've killed Faora. Because of a few punches when he doesn't even knows her name yet? You're laughable, he retreated because he didn't want Faora to get killed. When the **** did he ever say that? Perhaps doesn't means agreeing with someone, it means there can be a possibility. Good god. Oh shut up, I can see through your transparent agenda as clear as day. What are you trying to say here? That wonder woman was more skilled but weaker than Superman?
Can you read scans carter? He gripped his arm with both of his arms around that location and broke it. That's a classic way to illustrate breaking someone's arm by joints. Because Superman just had his arm broken carter. Superman wasn't even struggling to free his throat from Zod.
When he entered the tornado, it automatically attacked him. Have you ever went inside a twister? Same attack of different magnitude of power carter. Its like teaching rocket science to a child. Ocean master trapped diana in a tornado which Superman dispersed, Ocean Master created a tornado which had Superman helpless. In carter's world that means both were identical!!!
Good god. Pr was right, you actually hate superman. There can be no other explanation for such inane views as yours.
Lol...that was more than a push away and she did that while fighting another Herald. Wonder Woman, the Herald buster.
ABHI, I am going to say a statement to you and I want you to answer it for me. In a fight, I think I can beat you 10/10 without getting touched. Do you agree?
Also, she threatened Zod, not his girl. You are clearly making up stuff and with her threat, Zod did not deny that she was incapable of completing that task. Again I ask, if you and I got into a fight, I honestly believe I can crush that windpipe 10/10 without you touching me. Do you agree ABHIGAIL?
Nothing during that scene was showing as a joint dislocation. Good try though.
He froze the tornado from the OUTSIDE and then busted it open. When he was directly hit by the attack, he was immobilized. What's so hard to grasp? Move that brick wall out of the way.
I don't hate Superman but I do like WW and you discrediting her showing isn't going to go unnoticed my friend.
Who the **** cares? Eradicator nearly killed Supergirl and then Superman saved her and beat Eradicator in few attacks. The writer's intent was perfectly clear but hey lets take a interview and base all that stuff on it when the said writer turned on his own views.
And the official bio from her own comic.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/Supergirl-Zone-021_zpse83fde48.jpg
Originally posted by carver9So she beats hulk or Gladiator now? All she did was beat Faora, nothing more. A kryptonian with no feat at all.
Lol...that was more than a push away and she did that while fighting another Herald. Wonder Woman, the Herald buster.
ABHI, I am going to say a statement to you and I want you to answer it for me. In a fight, I think I can beat you 10/10 without getting touched. Do you agree?Heh, you couldn't beat my 10 year old niece at your best day carter.
Also, she threatened Zod, not his girl.And he was more concerned about Faora. She said she would kill him and all he said was perhaps you could. That's not an agreement.
You are clearly making up stuff and with her threat, Zod did not deny that she was incapable of completing that task.That's not agreing either. He saw her able to beat Faora and thought perhaps she could do it to him too. But that's not what's being discussed here. Its about strength and at no point she looked better than Zod in strength.
Again I ask, if you and I got into a fight, I honestly believe I can crush that windpipe 10/10 without you touching me.I would beat the shit out of you carter, don't delude yourself. Heck my dog can beat the shit out of you, perhaps.
Do you agree ABHIGAIL?Heh, stealing nicknames now? That's the best you can do?
Nothing during that scene was showing as a joint dislocation. Good try though.You need glasses. True story.
He froze the tornado from the OUTSIDE and then busted it open.Nope, he dived through it and neutralized it.
When he was directly hit by the attack, he was immobilized. What's so hard to grasp?Different power lever caver.
Move that brick wall out of the way.Shut the **** up, please.
I don't hate Superman but I do like WW and you discrediting her showing isn't going to go unnoticed my friend.Heh, you can't even lie straight. For years you've hated Superman, let me tell you one thing caver.
Superman isn't real.
