Originally posted by Trocity
Either Vader really isn't all that great then, or ROTJ Luke is a lot better than most people give him credit for, considering all evidence points to Luke holding back against Vader and Vader being willing to kill him during ROTJ while being f***ing amped by Palpatine?LOL! Anakin wins this easily.
RotJ Luke is a very underrated character yes. And while Vader was willing to kill him he did not want to do so without Luke realizing his choice. And no Sidious cannot passively amp another Force user and he wouldn't have done so anyways as he wanted to see if Luke could beat his father and was worth of being his replacement.
Originally posted by MythLord
He thinks of Anakin as a separate entity. 👆By showing us that Anakin has the potential comparable to Ones, as oppose to Luke who, in Oneness, gets smacked by Abeloth's avatar. 👆
Luke was openly doubting the Dark Side and turned off his lightsaber as he did not want to fight Leia. Immediately after the lightning shock he goes after Sheev himself, so no I'm not twisting the context -- you're forgetting it. 👆
Holy sh!t: Vader thinks he's one person who used to be another person. How you have no comprehension skills to understand that is beyond me. 👆
He thinks of him as his past self. He refers to himself in the third person because he views his former self as someone who was weak and naive.
On Mortis the most powerful Nexus in the Galaxy where he essentially was fulfilling the prophecy.
I'm aware. I'm saying he hadn't surpassed Vader even though he had accepted Sidious's training to a point.
I am well aware of this fact. It seems like all of you are the ones ignorant of such pretending that he wouldn't take into account his former abilities in an assessment of himself.
resonate
ˈrɛz(ə😉neɪt/
verb
verb: resonate; 3rd person present: resonates; past tense: resonated; past participle: resonated; gerund or present participle: resonating1.
produce or be filled with a deep, full, reverberating sound.
Since Vader obviously didn't produce the "waves of darkness" emanating from the Emperor, it's obviously his power being filled with the "waves of darkness" emanating from the Emperor. 👆
Originally posted by SunRazer
Other than the quote outright saying that Vader's power resonated with the waves of darkness flowing from the Emperor? Other than the Emperor being a Force nexus? Nexuses naturally/passively amp others. Vitiate also passively affects others with his Force presence, IIRC.
Their darkness "resonating" does not mean he's being amped.
A Force user who is a nexus of energy won't passively amp someone. Luke is an extremely focused point of force energy and yet he does not.
Please show me where Vitiate passively amped others.
Pretty sure there's a codex entry saying that Vitiate's presence withers the connections of Jedi to the light side and forces fear/pain etc. on them.
EDIT: Here's a quote saying that Sidious outright amps dark siders in his presence:
During the Rebellion era, dark side devotees become a bit more open, drawn by the power of the Emperor and their acceptance into his court. They are much easier to find anywhere in the Empire, especially in the Imperial Palace, where their power is focused and augmented by that of the Emperor.-- The Dark Side Sourcebook
Which allows the notion of Vader's powers being augmented by the Emperor to stand even without the quote from RotJ. We don't need to debate the meaning of "resonate".
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
I have school tomorrow. I'm off. I've become aware of the fact that none of you will post the numerous sources that have Vader musing on his past as you're blinded by bias so I'll probably be searching for those quotes most of the day then too. Goodnight.
You don't get to call other people biased, lol. I mean, you are the one who outright admitted to having personal and arbitrary quotas/thresholds that had to be satisfied for you to accept evidence.
Originally posted by Rebel95
It comes across as biased when all you do is come up with excuses for quotes putting Vader>Anakin and not providing any yourself.
Originally posted by SunRazer
Pretty sure there's a codex entry saying that Vitiate's presence withers the connections of Jedi to the light side and forces fear/pain etc. on them.EDIT: Here's a quote saying that Sidious outright amps dark siders in his presence:
Which allows the notion of Vader's powers being augmented by the Emperor to stand even without the quote from RotJ. We don't need to debate the meaning of "resonate".
Nothing says whether Sidious is actively or passively amping them. Or that he was doing either with Vader.
Originally posted by SunRazer
You don't get to call other people biased, lol. I mean, you are the one who outright admitted to having personal and arbitrary quotas/thresholds that had to be satisfied for you to accept evidence.
Yes. Because those are my standards. It would be disingenuous for me not to say what they are.
Also no, they're not arbitrary. I have very set guide lines for what I accept and do not accept and I have detailed them before.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
DD, not to be a dick, but I've noticed that according to you, people are only sheep, or trying to twist facts to suit their agenda whenever they disagree with you.Granted, I think things like Anakin=Yoda and Revan>Plagueis are cancer too, but still.
Generally that's the case.
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Nothing says whether Sidious is actively or passively amping them. Or that he was doing either with Vader.
It states that their powers are focused and augmented in the Imperial Palace by the Emperor. One would assume that the Emperor's presence is what does that. If you'd like to venture an alternative explanation, by all means do so, but as of yet, that's the only plausible explanation I'm seeing. Regarding passiveness or activeness, the Emperor has a busy routine. He can't be continuously increasing people's powers through active effort. It's obviously passive.
Vader's description in RotJ appears to resemble The Dark Side Sourcebook's analysis.
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNovaPack it up Pellycan, the Databank confirms that Anakin > Vader, so he wins.
I have school tomorrow. I'm off. I've become aware of the fact that none of you will post the numerous sources that have Vader musing on his past as you're blinded by bias so I'll probably be searching for those quotes most of the day then too. Goodnight.