Originally posted by Smurph
👆 maybe you're finally caught up.Skill is a separate stat from speed or energy projection. Skill is entirely about h2h skill. Nothing about the thread stips makes that 3 into a 1.5
He has no energy projection here, and his speed is turned off which also factors into overall durability in nature.
Hercules can penetrate his durability because he actually has the ability to harm him. Nefaria would go down straight away if he took a knee to his junk my guy. Hercules is just the guy that would do that. Yo go on enter the army if you’re young enough, and see if you can take on the drill instructor. I dare you.
This shit would be ugly.
Originally posted by StoicOk, so the "1-1.5 combat rating" was based on bullshit. 👆
He has no energy projection here, and his speed is turned off which also factors into overall durability in nature.Hercules can penetrate his durability because he actually has the ability to harm him. Nefaria would go down straight away if he took a knee to his junk my guy. Hercules is just the guy that would do that. Yo go on enter the army if you’re young enough, and see if you can take on the drill instructor. I dare you.
This shit would be ugly.
So speed and laser vision is no advantage at at all? You may not be seeing the big picture. Meditate for a moment upon the enormous nerf being presented in this case. Nefaria loses a vast speed advantage over Hercules, and he is no longer able to stun and repel him with his ocular attacks. Those powers are stacked with his overall Combat rating, or Score. Hercules has a higher rating, or Score at 4 out of 7. If you remove speed, and ocular attacks, which is the question that is actually being asked of us, according to the Opening Poster, is that Nefaria has been reduced to Herc’s speed level, which is a considerable bump, because he no longer has a time machine to move from one point to the other before his opponent is able to. It’s the exact same speed argument that it always is. Without it he loses a considerable amount of combat dominance.
He is the exact same speed as Hercules is, in this case. He can no longer repel Hercules by staring at him. What do you have left? He literally has no history, or knowledge of combat. Combat skill comes from training, you don’t just stumble onto it, and that is the case here with Hercules.
It wouldn’t be a long fight, trust me. Look at Mariusz Pudzianowsk, but with less knowledge. He could beat some, but Hercules won in nearly all of the first Olympic games, as is canon to his character.
Thor isn’t a slouch either.
Thor Blood Oath issues 3-4.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Lol No.And to prove what Smurph said about Hercules--
Stoic, since you're the Handbook expert, please show me where it says "combat ranking" and if speed is part of it, explain to me why it's its own stat.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Stoic, since you're the Handbook expert, please show me where it says "combat ranking" and if speed is part of it, explain to me why it's its own stat.
Fighting skill, or ability. Which is what he is rated as, which is his combat rating Delta. H2H, is what this is all about.
Originally posted by Stoic
Fighting skill, or ability. Which is what he is rated as, which is his combat rating Delta. H2H, is what this is all about.
It Says fighting SKILL , not fighting ability. You're trying to bullshit your way because your arguments are backfiring and you're doing worse in this debate than you insist Nefaria would do in this fight. His speed has nothing to do with it and you're just lying to straw grasp. Though I'm probably giving you too much credit and this explains you.
That's why you're making it up as you go along, not showing any skill feats for Hercules from the comics, ignoring the evidence presented to you and accusing others of doing that when your arguments have already been covered(you just pretend they weren't made), and try to salvage your Handbooks argument backfiring on you.
Ignorance is bliss. It’s what appears to power you up, kind of fascinating actually. I mean all you have to do to achieve this state is to pretend that a couple of brutal fighting styles vs zero knowledge doesn’t exist in this case.
Way to go. We should all think like you though. Never accept being wrong. Wait a sec.. Hmmm.
I don't know, maybe I need to give you more examples?
General Ross, NOT Rulk, is a 4. Wendigo, Rhino and Maestro are all scored 2.
So an old man (explicitly not in his Rulk persona) is almost twice that of Maestro. Zzax is also scored a 2.
Do you really need your hand held through this? Zzax has incredible energy projection compared to others in my post...but his fighting skills is ranked at 2. Old man Ross, just an old normal human guy, is ranked at 4.
Maestro is far stronger, Rhino is far more durable, Wendigo is far faster
Yet they all score a 2 on fighting SKILLS. This shows that skills is COMPLETELY SEPARATE FROM SPEED, DURABILITY, ENERGY PROJECTION AND/OR STRENGTH.
Your argument, Stoic, has no weight. You're arguing that Marvel takes strength, speed, durability, energy projection into account when scoring the fighting skills category.....but they don't. It's a completely separate attribute.
Again, General Ross, as a human, is a 4. Jarvis, an old butler, a 3. Sentry, someone far faster, stronger, durable, with much greater energy projection, is a 2. Maestro is a 2. Zzax is a 2. Wendigo, who has never seen the inside of a dojo in its life, is a 2.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I don't know, maybe I need to give you more examples?General Ross, NOT Rulk, is a 4. Wendigo, Rhino and Maestro are all scored 2.
So an old man (explicitly not in his Rulk persona) is almost twice that of Maestro. Zzax is also scored a 2.
Do you really need your hand held through this? Zzax has incredible energy projection compared to others in my post...but his fighting skills is ranked at 2. Old man Ross, just an old normal human guy, is ranked at 4.
Maestro is far stronger, Rhino is far more durable, Wendigo is far faster
Yet they all score a 2 on fighting SKILLS. This shows that skills is COMPLETELY SEPARATE FROM SPEED, DURABILITY, ENERGY PROJECTION AND/OR STRENGTH.Your argument, Stoic, has no weight. You're arguing that Marvel takes strength, speed, durability, energy projection into account when scoring the fighting skills category.....but they don't. It's a completely separate attribute.
Again, General Ross, as a human, is a 4. Jarvis, an old butler, a 3. Sentry, someone far faster, stronger, durable, with much greater energy projection, is a 2. Maestro is a 2. Zzax is a 2. Wendigo, who has never seen the inside of a dojo in its life, is a 2.
Ross has the mind of a military general. He knows how to fight because he was trained to fight using similar tactics to what is seen in Krav Maga. However his bulk may have hindered him from using more kicks than he did.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I don't know, maybe I need to give you more examples?General Ross, NOT Rulk, is a 4. Wendigo, Rhino and Maestro are all scored 2.
So an old man (explicitly not in his Rulk persona) is almost twice that of Maestro. Zzax is also scored a 2.
Do you really need your hand held through this? Zzax has incredible energy projection compared to others in my post...but his fighting skills is ranked at 2. Old man Ross, just an old normal human guy, is ranked at 4.
Maestro is far stronger, Rhino is far more durable, Wendigo is far faster
Yet they all score a 2 on fighting SKILLS. This shows that skills is COMPLETELY SEPARATE FROM SPEED, DURABILITY, ENERGY PROJECTION AND/OR STRENGTH.Your argument, Stoic, has no weight. You're arguing that Marvel takes strength, speed, durability, energy projection into account when scoring the fighting skills category.....but they don't. It's a completely separate attribute.
Again, General Ross, as a human, is a 4. Jarvis, an old butler, a 3. Sentry, someone far faster, stronger, durable, with much greater energy projection, is a 2. Maestro is a 2. Zzax is a 2. Wendigo, who has never seen the inside of a dojo in its life, is a 2.
There you go convincing yourself of things that don’t exist. Ross has the knowledge of a military general. Do you know what that means? It means that if I reduced Count Nefaria and all of the rest of those characters down to Ross’ level, he would beat the shit out of them. He has been trained to kill in unarmed combat. Fighting ability as in know how to fight. You can have a man in a wheel chair with the knowledge of Bruce Lee, but unable to use forms to exercise in his crippled condition, yet if you gave him a body that is capable of performance that knowledge would absolutely be demonstrated. Why because the knowledge still exists.
Did you really think that through? In no reality is a neophyte bar room brawler at best, going to beat a former Olympic wrestling, and pugilist champion that uses fouls. It’s just not a thing. Not when he can actually hurt his opponent.
Nefaria can not fight. Why not just read every early book that he was in. He even talks about his inadequacies in terms of physical combat. He was never a fighter. You really can’t get around that with Nefaria. If this was the Thing, or Black Panther, I’d vote Nefaria, because without gadgets or aid of some type, they don’t possess the physical power to hurt Nefaria, or at least they shouldn’t.
Hercules does though.