Well in this case he loses the speed advantage, flight, and laser vision. What does he have left? Been asking this question for a while now. All I seem to get from you are childish responses used to cover up that you have nothing to prove that Count Nefaria can actually defeat someone of Hercules skills with the OP’s reduced power set clause.
Show me this knowledge that he has.
We already answered long ago. You ignore the strength advantage Nefaria had on Thor by focusing on one page that suits your argument and ignoring everything else. Which isn't different in stupidity from you saying you don't have to show evidence but then demanding evidence.
Fighting skill is that. Skill. You've been told repeatedly. You're making this up that he has a fighting skill rating of 3 because of his powers. The power grid rankings does not at all support your stance. You are getting raped by your own hypocrisy.
YOU are the one who has to prove the fighting skill ranking is because of his speed. The actual explanations for rankings disprove your claims and have already been shown, so I don't have to prove anything.
Originally posted by Stoic
Hercules runs at 97 mph, or within that range, he’s definitely no slower than that. Count Nefaria can run at speeds approaching the speed of sound within an atmosphere. There is a huge amount of speed that he is losing, has lost his flight ability, and can no longer fire off energy blasts from his eyes. Has no record of being instructed in combat, against someone capable of hurting him, and is a former champion in boxing, and wrestling at the Olympic level.Only an idiot would argue that the slightly stronger fighter, with nearly no combat knowledge would win.
22 pages of I won’t accept being wrong, so I’ll attempt to move the goal posts, hurl insults, cheer lead, and use irrelevant points to escape admitting to be wrong.
Herc drops him within the first 10 seconds with a knee to his nutz capable of breaking Hoover dam, while fouling him with knees to the face, an additional punch to the nutz, and a pummeling that leaves both eyes closed shut. Based upon the way that Hercules fights on panel.
OK, maybe I should go slower.
What does this mean to you?
A separate question, what does the scan say for a rating of 3?
Simple enough questions.
Originally posted by Stoic
Show me his skill. Show me Count Nefaria’s skill. There is no mention of it in his bio, he states on panel that he was never a fighter, which is why he sought the powers that he did in the first place.Show me something or remain silent.
Providing this explanation for what, the fourth time?
Originally posted by Smurphthe mention is the definition of the same stat you rely on
Nefaria's fighting skill is 3, as you've repeatedly pointed out and relied on."3" = "Some training"
Meanwhile, Herc is "4", or "Experienced fighter"
Glad we have the handbooks to clear this up! So much for the master martial artist vs the untrained neophyte.
Originally posted by Delta1938
We already answered long ago. You ignore the strength advantage Nefaria had on Thor by focusing on one page that suits your argument and ignoring everything else. Which isn't different in stupidity from you saying you don't have to show evidence but then demanding evidence.Fighting skill is that. Skill. You've been told repeatedly. You're making this up that he has a fighting skill rating of 3 because of his powers. The power grid rankings does not at all support your stance. You are getting raped by your own hypocrisy.
YOU are the one who has to prove the fighting skill ranking is because of his speed. The actual explanations for rankings disprove your claims and have already been shown, so I don't have to prove anything.
He used his power during the entire confrontation with the Avengers, and does so again in a much later rematch. The OP is asking us, what would happen if he lost his speed, flight, and laser vision.
Are you still with me?
What we have here is a muscle man versus a man that was an Olympic level boxing, and wrestling champion. The skilled guy can hurt the strong man.
Do you believe that being stronger means that you will win a fight against a guy that can teach you how to fight in 2 different styles of fighting?
Those skills are canon to Hercules, we saw them on display against Thor, another seasoned fighter. This happened in Thor Blood Oath issues 3-4.
Originally posted by Stoic
Show me his skill. Show me Count Nefaria’s skill. There is no mention of it in his bio, he states on panel that he was never a fighter, which is why he sought the powers that he did in the first place.Show me something or remain silent.
I just can't get over how moronic and obstinate this is. You just come across like you cannot read but I have to believe this is deliberate.
"3". The "mention" is 3. Nobody in this thread would care about it but you kept citing it as proof that Nefaria has no training, when the simple and specific definition of 3 is... "some training".
And you've now spent like 16 pages flailing, unable to grasp that.
Originally posted by Stoic
He used his power during the entire confrontation with the Avengers, and does so again in a much later rematch. The OP is asking us, what would happen if he lost his speed, flight, and laser vision.Are you still with me?
What we have here is a muscle man versus a man that was an Olympic level boxing, and wrestling champion. The skilled guy can hurt the strong man.
Do you believe that being stronger means that you will win a fight against a guy that can teach you how to fight in 2 different styles of fighting?
Those skills are canon to Hercules, we saw them on display against Thor, another seasoned fighter. This happened in Thor Blood Oath issues 3-4.
And he didn't use speed against Thor, you're either lying or retarded arguing that, and his blasts were countered by Mjolnir. Nefaria even when his powers seemed to be dwindling(in fact according to the Handbooks they were) backhanded Thor like an inferior, and caught a charged Mjolnir strike.
By the way, Thor is equally as skilled as Hercules according to the Handbooks and had Mjolnir yet that wasn't enough.
Originally posted by Delta1938
And he didn't use speed against Thor, you're either lying or retarded arguing that, and his blasts were countered by Mjolnir. Nefaria even when his powers seemed to be dwindling(in fact according to the Handbooks they were) backhanded Thor like an inferior, and caught a charged Mjolnir strike.By the way, Thor is equally as skilled as Hercules according to the Handbooks and had Mjolnir yet that wasn't enough.
Count Nefaria did use his speed, he used all of his abilities as speed became an innate part of who he had become. We are not talking about Ultr-Boy here. Count Nefaria didn’t have the power to turn off an individual power. Every power that he has was on all of the time. Count Nefaria used speed to stop Thor’s downward swing from further harming him.
Thor was able to hurt Count Nefaria with a punch. Count Nefaria in this case would no longer have the luxury of quickly moving out of dangerous position before being stunned further.
Count Nefaria has never been trained, and has no idea how defend against a seasoned boxer, and wrestler who placed first in the Olympic Games games, and who also uses dirty fighting to exploit opponents. Canon skills for Hercules, and displayed on panel.
Thor is equally skilled as Hercules in H2H, however Hercules edged him out and defeated him in H2H combat without weapons. It even states that Hercules is slightly better, and slightly stronger than Thor. Read Thor Blood Oath 3-4.
Count Nefaria has a strength advantage here, and that is all.This advantage is not great enough to negate Herc’s ability to hurt Count Nefaria.
This is the reason that I posted the scan showing that Thor was able to hurt Nefaria. With no skill to cite in his entire history, Count Nefaria would be what is called Chipped Up. Little by little Hercules would beat the shit out of him. This is based upon his inability to fight at that level while being brought down to Hercules level speed.
I stopped reading as soon as you said he did use his speed, because you're either lying or don't know how comics work. Come back with actual proof from the comics, not assumptions(no catching Mjolnir is not a speed feat), and then I'll take you seriously. The comics made it clear when he was using his speed, and I saw none of that in the Thor fight.
Originally posted by Stoic
The speed that his hand rose to stop the strike was a speed feat. Not reading the rest will be regarded as you need to ignore the full facts surrounding the OP.
Prove it, not give claims or assumptions. I'm not the one ignoring facts, you are. They made it clear when he used his speed, show them making it clear in the Thor fight.